TermKit - a graphical terminal replacement • Hacker News Board

Re: TermKit - a graphical terminal replacement

#101

Post by amosson » Wed, May 18, 2011, 5:27 PM UTC

william42 wrote: post #97

amosson wrote: post #92

The terminal hasn't changed much in 40 years because it very good at what it does, that is, allowing experts to get stuff done . One of the usability lessons of modern computing is that the mouse is a productivity killer. Having transitioned back to vi from TextMate, I have certainly found it to be true. The author talks about how its a shame to give 2MM pixels to an 80 column terminal, but from what I've seen, devel…

«One of the usability lessons of modern computing is that the mouse is a productivity killer.» Actually, one of the usability lessons of modern computing is that the mouse makes you faster, but the keyboard makes you think you're faster. reference: http://www.asktog.com/TOI/toi06KeyboardVMouse1.html

Here is Atwood's response

http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/2008/03/revisiting-keyboard...

Re: TermKit - a graphical terminal replacement

#102

Post by bostonvaulter2 » Wed, May 18, 2011, 5:36 PM UTC

colomon wrote: post #72

roqetman wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is amusing how we hackers, who are supposed to embrace change, become as Luddite as anyone else when our sacred tools are questioned. Personally I see room for this and a whole lot more. I'd like to see an amalgam of this and the traditional terminal (easy way to pull up a traditional terminal if you need it). There is no need to "replace"; I think this makes a fine addition to a hackers workspace.

Thing is, it's not about the tools being sacred. My problem with this is that he's not just solving problems I don't have -- he's solving them in a way that would make my problems worse! For instance, I very rarely want more informations about the files from an "ls" command; and if I did, I'd probably use Finder instead. On the other hand, not having enough terminal real estate to display the entire directory at once…

Regarding the too-small windows for ls output option I would love if his ls could display it's output full-screen temporarily rather than needing to make the terminal full-screen first and then running ls

Re: TermKit - a graphical terminal replacement

#103

Post by bostonvaulter2 » Wed, May 18, 2011, 5:38 PM UTC

unconed wrote: post #41

wladimir wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm also a bit disappointed on how most people here react. I personally think your idea is great and pretty futuristic. I would certainly use a tool like this. Also it's open source so if a specific detail (such as the font) bugs them it can simply be changed. I've had similar ideas (based on Python) but never got around to executing them. Keep up the good work and don't let the angry bearded UNIX dinosaurs get to yo…

Regarding your quote problem: the idea is that the highlighted token signifies "quoted string". I plan to add regexp tokens, user@host tokens, etc. each with appropriate autocomplete. I thought the current minimalistic approach was ok, but it might be worth to add subtle quotes around the edges to reinforce the idea. That's why it's made out of HTML/CSS...

That sounds great, although I would like to have a nice fall-back for those odd programs that the terminal doesn't know the appropriate token for.

Re: TermKit - a graphical terminal replacement

#104

Post by uniclaude » Wed, May 18, 2011, 5:40 PM UTC

unconed wrote: post #25

unconed wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To address some of your concerns: - Monospace fonts for code is definitely in. Try catting a .js file, it will get syntax highlighted. Most likely, it doesn't recognize the mime type of your file. It's using the old mime.types DB + some custom additions... also, the highlighter I'm using only has so many languages defined. I looked for the most comprehensive / least fail one. - Regarding vim... I admit I just don't l…

And on another note... it's been hilarious how people have been questioning my professional credentials just because I want to make something more usable. I've implemented over a dozen RFCs, can match regexps with the best of them and do know which end of a pipe does what ;).

It's just my point of view, I don't really like the stance seem to take here.

You built something great, made it open source, which is even more great, and you're here to answer people, which is amazing. Now, please don't act like "I implemented x RFCs, I can do y like the best...", it's simply useless here. One reason is that people already know you can code well, and they can even read your source if they want to know better, there's no need to brag. Another reason is that HN is the place of some very good developers, and I believe humility is appreciated here, at least until you build some life changing software (and I won't debate about what is or is not life changing).

Anyways, thanks for building this and releasing the source code as open, it's cool.

Re: TermKit - a graphical terminal replacement

#105

Post by bostonvaulter2 » Wed, May 18, 2011, 5:46 PM UTC

I'd like to see it be able to run a program in the background with the -h flag or --help flag to find at run-time what the available options are to help auto-completion. This way it would be able to support even programs that it doesn't know a priori.

This looks like a fantastic direction to experiment in. Kudos to the author.

Re: TermKit - a graphical terminal replacement

#106

Post by rbranson » Wed, May 18, 2011, 5:57 PM UTC

This will replace the terminal as much as the microwave replaced metal over fire for cooking or as much as synthesizers replaced real instruments in music.

Re: TermKit - a graphical terminal replacement

#107

Post by swlkr » Wed, May 18, 2011, 5:58 PM UTC

Wow this is awesome. This project basically just showed me everything I never knew I wanted.

Re: TermKit - a graphical terminal replacement

#108

Post by 9999 » Wed, May 18, 2011, 6:00 PM UTC

colomon wrote: post #72

roqetman wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is amusing how we hackers, who are supposed to embrace change, become as Luddite as anyone else when our sacred tools are questioned. Personally I see room for this and a whole lot more. I'd like to see an amalgam of this and the traditional terminal (easy way to pull up a traditional terminal if you need it). There is no need to "replace"; I think this makes a fine addition to a hackers workspace.

Thing is, it's not about the tools being sacred. My problem with this is that he's not just solving problems I don't have -- he's solving them in a way that would make my problems worse! For instance, I very rarely want more informations about the files from an "ls" command; and if I did, I'd probably use Finder instead. On the other hand, not having enough terminal real estate to display the entire directory at once…

"if I did, I'd probably use Finder instead."

The thing that strikes me as very, very cool about this project is that you might not need the Finder at all any more.

Re: TermKit - a graphical terminal replacement

#109

Post by sanderjd » Wed, May 18, 2011, 6:22 PM UTC

stcredzero wrote: post #90

freshhawk wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? I see the same thing whenever you get a bunch of professionals together and start arguing about their tools. Doctors and different drugs/treatments, Contractors and brands of power tools. Programmers do seem to make the biggest deal about "all the fighting", everyone else seems to just accept that professionals are opinionated and arguing is how progress is made. But I'm on the inside with the programming stu…

Doctors and different drugs/treatments, Contractors and brands of power tools. From what I've seen, smart Doctors and Contractors eventually get to discussing empirical data and costs. Far too often, I've seen programmers just make up crap and state it emphatically.

Very good point. Do doctors and contractors have more sources of empirical data (or more widely known sources), or are they simply more willing to look for them? Does anyone here know of a good general resource for empirical data regarding the tools we are constantly debating?

Re: TermKit - a graphical terminal replacement

#110

Post by mixmastamyk » Wed, May 18, 2011, 6:22 PM UTC

Looks pretty cool. The problem with the vast majority of these 'rethinking' projects though is they never get finished. That's the hard part.

The classic unix toolset remains because it is finished--that is most major problems and workflow have been ironed out.

Unfortunately I'm time-constrained these days so I'll give it a go when it version five is out and all major issues have been addressed and ported to Linux. For now I'll use fish locally and bash over ssh on my servers. Also, as I can use nautilus to manage and edit remote files using gvfs. So I've already got most of what the project offers working today.