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My Experience at Apple

ex-apple-engineer.medium.com

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Re: My Experience at Apple

#381

Post by Der_Einzige »

newbie578 wrote: post #22

I have to ask, why is it so hard to criticize or show Apple in a negative light on HN? If this was a post thrashing Google, it would already have over 300 upvotes, and "necessary" comments how there are already people who are "de-Googling" their life... I mean there are already skeptic comments regarding the author's intentions and experience? The fact is that out of all FAA(M)NG companies, work experience in Apple i…

I don't know anything about the work experiences at netflix, and the total number of employees there is a small fraction of what it is at Apple...

Re: My Experience at Apple

#382

Post by nilshauk »

My heart breaks for this engineer. We can’t just file this under “it happens at all large companies” and call it a day. Large companies like Apple should be held to a higher standard.

With the rise of evaluating company stocks based on Environmental, Social and Governance (ESG) shareholders should start demanding that companies publish anonymized statistics on number of HR cases reported and how they were handled. Workplace abuse can happen everywhere but larger companies like Apple need to double-down and start showing that they are handling it.

This _might_ sound utopian. But shareholder value is about the only thing companies like Apple care about.

Apple held a modicum of respect in my book for stepping up to protect privacy. Reading a piece like this tears that away. I’m reminded that Apple is yet another gigantic tech company. The ends doesn’t justify the means. Great products doesn’t justify abuse.

Re: My Experience at Apple

#383

Post by w0mbat »

markvdb wrote: post #83

This kind of story is why your first priority when you start earning a salary should be to save up some f k you money. That should be about ten times easier on a software developer salary than on anything else, so consider yourself lucky.

Absolutely. I had a shitty experience at Apple, manager/team lead treated me as a beginner despite me being in a senior engineer role and I was highly experienced from some other major companies. He thought time at Apple was the only metric. He constantly questioned my code, despite it being actually much better than his, and more Apple style. Would give me no latitude to implement features independently that I could do in my sleep.

But I had “fuck you” money saved. It had been my dream to work at Apple, but after 6 months I called it quits, told that asshole where to stick his job.

Re: My Experience at Apple

#384

Post by geophile »

andrewem wrote: post #218
geophile wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood the supposed attraction of "just like a startup, but in a big company!". That appears to mean that you will work in a small team, putting in unsustainable hours, but not receive the financial reward that a successful startup could provide. I've worked in several startups, and occasional death marches are unavoidable. They don't work month in and month out. But enduring that kind of life for just sa…

The other notable thing about “just like a startup but in a big company” (often for startups which have been acquired) is the frequent claim that the startup will be left alone by the rest of the company. Every single process and incentive is against that remaining true. Maybe in some cases you can hope for the acquired startup to be the pet project of the acquirer’s founder/CEO?

I knew that to work out exactly once, (not a company I was at).

Re: My Experience at Apple

#386

Post by benhurmarcel »

praptak wrote: post #237
Symbiote wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or in Europe etc, join a/the union. The union least has lawyers experienced in this kind of trouble, and they are cheap/free to use for members.

I don't believe any of the FAANG companies have unions, not even in Europe. This is still good advice though - unions will probably help you even as a non-member.

In many European countries the presence of unions isn't optional, it's compulsory above a company size threshold for example. It doesn't mean employees have to be part of it, but it has to be present.

Re: My Experience at Apple

#387

Post by PaulDavisThe1st »

bdowling wrote: post #352
xvector wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is easy to say but very difficult to actually do. Immigrants are typically more desperate and companies take advantage of that.

> Immigrants are typically more desperate and companies take advantage of that. An immigrant non-citizen employee who is harmed by an employer has just as much of a right to sue the employer as a citizen employee.

Have you paid attention to the behavior of USCIS employees over the last 4 years, notably towards people with backgrounds in predominantly Muslim countries (as the author of TFA appears to be)? It's not so much that you're wrong, more that it doesn't matter that you're right.

Re: My Experience at Apple

#388

Post by throwaway44295 »

sokoloff wrote: post #5

It’s a long, rambling post with some fairly vague and difficult to falsify accusations. I have no connections to Apple (other than as a consumer), but I could not wade through the article enough to determine if I thought there was an actual smoking gun. I suspect the story would be much more powerful if it were 1/5 as long and stuck to the material facts.

It's the only way to tell the story. Of course it's an uncomfortable read, how could it be different? IMHO this should be indeed picked up by a journalist though. It's not an engineer's job to write catching stories.

Re: My Experience at Apple

#389

Post by anonymousiam »

throwaway44295 wrote: post #375
anonymousiam wrote: post #189

Apple is a big company with a great reputation, but there are bad apples in every bunch. My biggest takeaway from this article is that the author should take this advice: Before you accept a position, find out what project you will be working on, and get to know the people who you will be working with. If you are being hired to replace someone who left, try to find out why they left (or were fired). I have not done m…

> She no longer works for Apple, and probably doesn't want to ever work there again, so why the threat, and why the ultimatum? I'd definitely check with a lawyer on this. I think one could get into serious legal trouble when publishing names

I agree, but I am assuming she has sufficient proof of her allegations to stand up to any case of defamation, liable, or slander.

"Truth is an absolute defense to libel claims, because one of the elements that must be proven in a defamation suit is falsity of the statement."

Re: My Experience at Apple

#390

Post by th33ngineer »

dreamcompiler wrote: post #212

Things new engineers don't know, but should: 1. HR doesn't work for you; they work to minimize liability for the company. If HR thinks the best way to accomplish that is to destroy your life, that's exactly what they will do. 2. Many SV companies, as well as groups within large, respected SV companies, only survive through exploitation. They exploit their customers, their workforce, or both. Exploitation means obtain…

> and reputation intact

I'm staying at [large SV company] for now BECAUSE OF their reputation of hiring smart engineers, so that I will be able to hopefully get a gig at a more employee-friendly company later in life. New grads that were in my position often don't have much of a choice, and being offered the ability to pay off my student debt almost immediately at 22 seemed irresponsible to pass up. It's been 4 years and my mental health has degraded for sure (and the work I am doing is not glamorous in the slightest) but my savings are piling up and the thought that this is only temporary (and will give me a nice financial cushion) will keep me going until it's unbearable.

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