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My Experience at Apple

ex-apple-engineer.medium.com

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Re: My Experience at Apple

#331

Post by dvtrn »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #186
exApple-anon wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some extra tidbits that didn't make it in because the edit timer ran out: - Despite the big release and herculean efforts, both of us were paid a fraction of our target bonus. This was the day I decided to move jobs. - I eventually grew some balls and told Apple to (a) pay me 2.5x during overtime (b) hire SREs for this critical service, or (c) go fuck themselves. They chose (c), which worked alright because our servi…

I can empathize with your story. I once landed what I thought would be my dream job at my dream company. I quickly discovered that the position was open because all of the previous team had quit due to the extreme toxicity. > The primary lesson I learnt is that it doesn't matter if you work hard Be careful about getting jaded and cynical. This is far from a universal truth in the tech industry. I've hired a few ex-FA…

The last few jobs I’ve had were glowing from the interviews and believe me I asked some very tough questions I hoped would be revealing enough without torpedoing my candidacy.

Every one of them: as soon as I started, the foundational person of the team quit, you know the guy or gal who burned themselves out building the process. Fixing all the cruft and actually trying to unfuck everything but leaving scant documentation because the mountain of technical debt rivaled the heights of K2?

As a result I had to “drink from the water hose” constantly. And this is something I am absolutely sick of doing, and no team should tolerate it.

It’s happened so often I’m beginning to wonder a) how I can assess if the team is bleeding talent (I’ve had companies straight up lie about things like attrition and retention) or b) if I just have some kind of gravitational pull for companies that are running people out the door.

Re: My Experience at Apple

#332

Post by mgh2 »

newbie578 wrote: post #22

I have to ask, why is it so hard to criticize or show Apple in a negative light on HN? If this was a post thrashing Google, it would already have over 300 upvotes, and "necessary" comments how there are already people who are "de-Googling" their life... I mean there are already skeptic comments regarding the author's intentions and experience? The fact is that out of all FAA(M)NG companies, work experience in Apple i…

Because when people's belief systems are threatened, they react as if they are being personally attacked.

Apple's cult following is treated as a religion by its fans. I see this with religions or cults that attack others who criticize them with similar tactics: denial, obfuscation, manipulation, deflection, shaming, name-calling, threats, etc.

Aside from technical criticisms - which the tech community in HN values and encourages, a different and recent example is that of long time labor abuses. The initial articles have not gathered enough attention, but once they did, you start to notice some user burying and flagging. They have just recently resurfaced due to more evidence being discovered.

Apple: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25570247

Tesla: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25360432

Sometimes you have to punch your way into brainwashed people's minds to make them see the truth (ex: overwhelm them with evidence).

Re: My Experience at Apple

#333

Post by worker767424 »

x0x0 wrote: post #285
throwaway29303 wrote: post #193

This is awful. I'm sorry that happened to you. However, If Apple refuse to take actions, I will interview with major media outlets describing the experience in more details and I will release a list of all individuals involved from senior management to the HR director and all the evidence as public record. You're wasting your time if you think they're going to do anything with this kind of approach. Get a lawyer firs…

The author is... well, I don't think interviews are going to go the way he or she thinks. To wit, reading part 1, the first paragraph boils down to "my manager was on vacation for my start date. I was provided with an onboarding buddy, who warned me that Apple is trigger happy firing folks." Para 2: manager made a likely inappropriate joke about last name. para 3: not really relevant? para 4: project was raw. para 5:…

Agreed. This is really only interesting to journalists if they're building a story like the NYT/Amazon one a few years back.

> googling the author's name for quite a long time

Yup. Especially for someone with one year of experience and needing a visa, this isn't a good look.

Re: My Experience at Apple

#334

Post by bdowling »

zcw100 wrote: post #161
andrewmcwatters wrote: post #80

For anyone experiencing workplace harassment, this article is a great example of what not to do. Instead, document everything happening to you with evidence, speak with HR about incidents as they arise, and if they don't take action, seek legal counsel. Doing anything else will paint you in a bad light.

You've clearly never had this happen to you. Go ahead, document everything, it's not going to matter. That's not how this works. If you do that they'll either say, "Ok, I see what you've got there. But that's not what we're here to discuss. We're here to discuss your negative attitude" or they can look at your documentation and say, "So what were you charging the time you were doing all this documentation to?", or, "…

> Go to HR? Are you kidding me? First, HR is not your friend.

The purpose of going to HR is so that the employee's attorney can later show that the company (1) had actual knowledge of the abuse and (2) subsequently did nothing.

Re: My Experience at Apple

#335

Post by worker767424 »

someonehere wrote: post #232

I worked for Apple retail in San Francisco. Being an early retail employee in the Bay Area, we had very close ties to Cupertino. I worked when Steve was still alive. * Retail management in my store ruled by fear. I heard from other stores across the US this was the same as well. * Promotions were handed out to those who kissed ass the hardest. Even if they were unqualified or cheated on promotion exams, if they brown…

> Being an early retail employee in the Bay Area, we had very close ties to Cupertino. I worked when Steve was still alive.

Steve Jobs actually interacted with retail underlings?!

Re: My Experience at Apple

#336

Post by qppo »

derivagral wrote: post #299
SkyPuncher wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work at a startup right now and can count the number of times I've had to work overtime with a null-pointer - 0. Well run startups can still compete by making smart, focused decisions.

I've never had a startup that hasn't roped me into a production support on-call for a month or more in addition to regular duties. Under 10 engineers, 50 engineers, 500+ engineers: they've all done this.

I've never worked on a product where it ever made sense to be "on call." I'm an engineer, not a doctor.

Re: My Experience at Apple

#337

Post by magicfractal »

it’s very sad, this is clearly someone that has suffered a lot of trauma and abuse and feels completely powerless. Imo, we’re seeing what the US immigration system does to folks, all labor protection laws are useless if you have one month to leave the country after losing your job.

My heart goes to you anon! Don’t think that your career is over! There’s many other places in the world you can start afresh and have great quality of living and better protections such as Europe and Canada.

Re: My Experience at Apple

#338

Post by Apocryphon »

zepto wrote: post #300
opportune wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it has to do purely with visibility outside the company. Visibility within the company is just as, if not more, important. A common theme I've noticed regarding this in stories from Apple is people covering up/scapegoating failing projects by lying to management, creating fake reports, fabricating data, etc. The con seems able to be kept up for a long time because there is only one person you need to fo…

Is there a collection of stories like this about Apple where you have been able to see a common theme?

There's a few here and there

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25606200

Re: My Experience at Apple

#339

Post by worker767424 »

xenihn wrote: post #260
someonehere wrote: post #232

I worked for Apple retail in San Francisco. Being an early retail employee in the Bay Area, we had very close ties to Cupertino. I worked when Steve was still alive. * Retail management in my store ruled by fear. I heard from other stores across the US this was the same as well. * Promotions were handed out to those who kissed ass the hardest. Even if they were unqualified or cheated on promotion exams, if they brown…

Sounds like Disney.

Explains why Pixar was such a good fit with Disney.

Re: My Experience at Apple

#340

Post by SkyPuncher »

andy_ppp wrote: post #231
SkyPuncher wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work at a startup right now and can count the number of times I've had to work overtime with a null-pointer - 0. Well run startups can still compete by making smart, focused decisions.

I completely agree, sure if you’re into a feature and on a roll in a startup keep going but if you’ve reached a good point to stop no need to cause yourself stress!

There are definitely days I work late, but that's almost always by choice. When I do work late, it means shorter days for me later in the week.
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