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Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

theguardian.com

71–80 of 116 posts

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#71
post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It literally does though. Drunk driving removes the usability of their cars that they could've spent tens of thousands of dollars on this.

There is a clear and important distinction between restrictions on how property can be used, and the government literally seizing property. Trying to argue that those are one and the same is just silly. A better parallel would be fining based on emissions, which I would be fine with. But actually seizing private property? Hell no.

> But actually seizing private property? Hell no.

Yeah like your car being seized due to not paying the yearly registration fee?

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#72
post #15
post #4

Low Tech Magazine, one of my favorite sites online, has written a few articles on wood and biomass: - Well-Tended Fires Outperform Modern Cooking Stoves: https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2014/06/thermal-efficiency-c... - Too Much Combustion, Too Little Fire: https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2019/12/too-much-combustion-... - How to Make Biomass Energy Sustainable Again: https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2020/09/how-to-mak…

Low Tech Magazine is pretty much bullshit from cover to cover and these articles are great examples of the genre. Read the first one with a critical eye. It doesn't make any sense. It's just a deceptive argument constructed to make performative primitivism seem competitive with modern technology, which it isn't. An electric induction cooker is superior to any kind of fire, in all aspects and ways, by large margins in…

If you actually read the article you'll see that by "outperform" they're comparing the efficiency of a wood stove in converting biomass to useful heat, against the efficiency of a power plant and electric stove in converting fuel to useful heat.

It's no surprise that a wood stove did better in that comparison. It's one conversion vs two. It's a perfectly reasonable comparison to make in many circumstances, eg in poorer countries with less well developed electricity infrastructure who still need to transition away from fossil fuels.

From the article:

> This means that if your electric stove is operated by electricity from a biomass power plant -- a fast growing "green" trend nowadays -- the power conversion efficiency is three to four times lower (11-14%) than the authors of the study assume, and thermal efficiency drops to about 5%. This is similar to the thermal efficiency of a neglected open fire, and one-tenth the thermal efficiency of a rocket stove. Likewise, a cookstove which uses coal or gas directly to heat food is much more energy efficient than a cookstove that runs on electricity produced by a coal or gas power plant.

Re: air pollution, they're completely right to point out that cooking itself - regardless of the heat source used - generates tons of indoor air pollution anyway, making the air pollution concern of wood fired stoves not as clear as you'd expect. You should be ventilating all cooking to the outdoors.

> Any biomass stove design with a chimney basically achieves the same. If a chimney is added to an indoor biomass stove, indoor air pollution drops to almost zero.

They're also quite clear that these trade-offs differ for poor vs rich countries:

> Although it's remarkable how the proposed solutions for this energy inefficiency differ for poor and rich countries. In the developing world, the focus is mainly on designing more efficient biomass stoves that produce fewer pollutants. While achieved savings as a result of switching to biogas would be larger, its investment would be 30 times higher compared to the distribution of improved wood cooking stoves.

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#73
Many people do small fires and try to let the fire alive as long as possible. The consequences are that the stove is not hot enough to ignite the fumes. This yields to a poor fire: low efficiency, high particle emissions, and poor heat.

The "real" way is to light it from the top, and don't be afraid to make a big one.

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#74
post #69

I have a neighbor who burns wood every day, and I bought an air quality monitor to see what the impact is on our air. The AQI hits 150 when it’s burning, which is really unhealthy. I was surprised it was this bad, especially since he’s not that close of a neighbor (on a different street even).

Which air quality monitor did you purchase?

I’m using a PocketLab device. I actually know the PocketLab guys from the Intel Education Accelerator; we were in the initial cohort together. I would have otherwise purchased a purple air device.

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#75
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Outdoor wood furnaces (boilers) became very popular over the last 15 years. They are cheaper than fuel oil. A traditional wood stove has to be refilled every 2 hours (or so), and is also a major fire hazard. "Wood burners" may also include pellet stoves which are also increasingly popular for similar reasons.

Can't say I've ever seen an outdoor boiler in a home counties garden. But maybe you're talking about something specific?

Three minute video:

* https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_PL0yBdvSxA

12 minute video from an owner:

* https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQc8p-roy-E

Popular for off-grid situations.

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#77

I have a neighbor who burns wood every day, and I bought an air quality monitor to see what the impact is on our air. The AQI hits 150 when it’s burning, which is really unhealthy. I was surprised it was this bad, especially since he’s not that close of a neighbor (on a different street even).

> I have a neighbor who burns wood every day, and I bought an air quality monitor to see what the impact is on our air.

How old is their unit? The new EPA BurnWise standard seems to really help things with efficiency and particulate.

As a rule of thumb: the exhaust gases should be clear. If it's not (i.e., black or grey smoke), then there's lots of material that hasn't been combusted which is wasteful and unhealthy.

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#79
post #38

I am surprised to learn that burning wood for heat/cooking is something done outside Amish type communities at any significant level in the developed world.

On the Old Continent, there are a lot of old houses (I'm writing from a 400 year old one, older than the USA), about 10% being more than 100 year old [1], most of which comes with a central chimney (or several). While a lot of people have other heating/cooking systems, those chimney are still in use to some capacity. [1] http://www.iut.nu/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/Housing-Statist...

This could be why I haven't heard of it. I live in an urban area, but have never heard much about wood burning as a significant heat source in any nearby rural area or any area where my relatives live. And in Canada, it is basically only the 200 year old places that do it.

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/11-526-s/2013002/t002-en...

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#80

I am surprised to learn that burning wood for heat/cooking is something done outside Amish type communities at any significant level in the developed world.

My parents weren't able to afford to get any other kind of heating for our home. What they could do is put in the work to find and prepare a supply of wood. To this day they still use it for heating
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