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Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

theguardian.com

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Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#51

Post by generalizations »

aaomidi wrote: post #50
generalizations wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> these burners should be seized and replaced Wood is far cheaper than alternatives, often even free (e.g., a neighbor cuts down a tree, you get rid of it for them). Financial assistance is onerous to obtain. You're also assuming it's appropriate for some government beurocrat to make such a decision on the first place. "It's my woodstove, you can't have it."

> You're also assuming it's appropriate for some government beurocrat to make such a decision on the first place. " China banned the country from getting pallets of plastic because once they factored in the public health costs, it wasn't profitable (and it was barely profitable before hand). The government bans people from driving while drunk because they have a potential to hurt others. We have precedence for the go…

There's a clear difference between prohibiting drunk driving, and telling me I can't continue to use my wood stove inside my own home.

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#53

Post by JoeAltmaier »

generalizations wrote: post #51
aaomidi wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You're also assuming it's appropriate for some government beurocrat to make such a decision on the first place. " China banned the country from getting pallets of plastic because once they factored in the public health costs, it wasn't profitable (and it was barely profitable before hand). The government bans people from driving while drunk because they have a potential to hurt others. We have precedence for the go…

There's a clear difference between prohibiting drunk driving, and telling me I can't continue to use my wood stove inside my own home.

There's also a pretty strong similarity. We're all driving the same roads; we're all breathing the same air.

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#54

Post by ashtonkem »

irq wrote: post #28
gnicholas wrote: post #7

I have a neighbor who burns wood every day, and I bought an air quality monitor to see what the impact is on our air. The AQI hits 150 when it’s burning, which is really unhealthy. I was surprised it was this bad, especially since he’s not that close of a neighbor (on a different street even).

I, too, have a neighbor with a wood burner (used during the cold months only fortunately) that easily adds 75 to 100 to the outdoor AQI (using Purple Air). My indoor air quality is unaffected due to central air filtering. Given the health impact, these burners should be seized and replaced with almost anything else, with full financial assistance. (Why? It's cheaper to replace these burners than it is to suffer the l…

I’m a huge fan of providing incentives for people to upgrade, but I would fight tooth and nail against seizing inefficient burners. Opening up the door for the government to randomly deprive citizens of their property is an awful door to open, and it will be abused eventually, no matter how just the cause feels today.

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#55

Post by brlewis »

generalizations wrote: post #51
aaomidi wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You're also assuming it's appropriate for some government beurocrat to make such a decision on the first place. " China banned the country from getting pallets of plastic because once they factored in the public health costs, it wasn't profitable (and it was barely profitable before hand). The government bans people from driving while drunk because they have a potential to hurt others. We have precedence for the go…

There's a clear difference between prohibiting drunk driving, and telling me I can't continue to use my wood stove inside my own home.

Absolutely. Keep 100% of the smoke inside your own home, and it's nobody's business except yours and your home mortgage company's.

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#56

Post by jefft255 »

jeffbee wrote: post #15
spodek wrote: post #4

Low Tech Magazine, one of my favorite sites online, has written a few articles on wood and biomass: - Well-Tended Fires Outperform Modern Cooking Stoves: https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2014/06/thermal-efficiency-c... - Too Much Combustion, Too Little Fire: https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2019/12/too-much-combustion-... - How to Make Biomass Energy Sustainable Again: https://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2020/09/how-to-mak…

Low Tech Magazine is pretty much bullshit from cover to cover and these articles are great examples of the genre. Read the first one with a critical eye. It doesn't make any sense. It's just a deceptive argument constructed to make performative primitivism seem competitive with modern technology, which it isn't. An electric induction cooker is superior to any kind of fire, in all aspects and ways, by large margins in…

I agree that this article paints an unrealistic picture, and that broadly speaking an induction stove is "superior". But I disagree with "in all aspects and ways, by large margins in every direction". Cooking meat on a wood fire gives a very distinct char and flavor which I don't believe you can replicate perfectly on an induction stove. I personally love that taste.

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#57

Post by aqrit »

chrisseaton wrote: post #27
aqrit wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Outdoor wood furnaces (boilers) became very popular over the last 15 years. They are cheaper than fuel oil. A traditional wood stove has to be refilled every 2 hours (or so), and is also a major fire hazard. "Wood burners" may also include pellet stoves which are also increasingly popular for similar reasons.

Can't say I've ever seen an outdoor boiler in a home counties garden. But maybe you're talking about something specific?

www.central-boiler.co.uk ?

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#58

Post by ashtonkem »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #53
generalizations wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a clear difference between prohibiting drunk driving, and telling me I can't continue to use my wood stove inside my own home.

There's also a pretty strong similarity. We're all driving the same roads; we're all breathing the same air.

Prohibiting drunk driving doesn’t involve depriving citizens of their property, especially property that was legal when they bought it.

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#59

Post by aaomidi »

generalizations wrote: post #51
aaomidi wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You're also assuming it's appropriate for some government beurocrat to make such a decision on the first place. " China banned the country from getting pallets of plastic because once they factored in the public health costs, it wasn't profitable (and it was barely profitable before hand). The government bans people from driving while drunk because they have a potential to hurt others. We have precedence for the go…

There's a clear difference between prohibiting drunk driving, and telling me I can't continue to use my wood stove inside my own home.

Is the difference that the other one makes sense because it's been around for decades while this one is an emerging study?

If your wood burning is proven to increase the risk of cancer for your neighbours, what does that mean?

Re: Avoid using wood burning stoves if possible, warn health experts

#60

Post by aaomidi »

ashtonkem wrote: post #58
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's also a pretty strong similarity. We're all driving the same roads; we're all breathing the same air.

Prohibiting drunk driving doesn’t involve depriving citizens of their property, especially property that was legal when they bought it.

It literally does though. Drunk driving removes the usability of their cars that they could've spent tens of thousands of dollars on this.
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