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Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

ajkesslerblog.com

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Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#101

Post by jasonkester »

ido wrote: post #97
jasonkester wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, and I think that's what the author was saying too. One example: Craftsman Hand Tools. They have a lifetime guarantee, so provided you don't lose them, you're done buying screwdrivers and wrenches for life. True story. I walked into Sears with a broken socket wrench. Sears guy: "Wow. What happened to that ?" Me: "Well, I had a bolt that really didn't want to come loose, so I had a six foot cheater bar and I wa…

I've had that same conversation on 3 different occasions, each with ludicrously mis-used tools broken entirely through my foolishness. All replaced for free with a smile. Let me guess - you live in the US. Good luck getting the same result in Europe ;)

Uh, sure. You're right. Sears are thin on the ground over here.

In case I wasn't clear, all the abovementioned conversations happened at Sears department store, the sole distributor of Craftsman hand tools. They have an explicit policy of replacing any broken tool, regardless of how you broke it.

So if you rock up with the snapped-off handle of one of those tiny little flathead screwdrivers (complete with a little clip so that you can keep it in your shirt pocket), and a story about how you were trying to pry off a rusted-on cylinder head using it and a large hammer, they'll replace it.

(as I have personally verified)

And yeah, you're right about the European version of customer service (at least the English variant). Since moving here, I've never once come across a merchant who was familiar with the concept of "the customer is always right". Rather, "It's my shop, so by definition I'm right. And why are there so many customers in here, anyway? I think I'll start closing at 5:30 so I don't have to deal with them."

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#102

Post by mironathetin »

copenja wrote: post #20

Wow, I disagree. Starting with expensive shoes. I wear flip-flops, shorts, and a t-shirt to work everyday. I'm pretty comfortable. I don't see the correlation between expensive footwear and comfort. Beds. Yes, you spend 1/3 your life in bed. And you spend it unconscious. You spend about 0.03% of your conscious life in bed while falling asleep (30 mins a day). But more importantly: Relax. Just because you make a certa…

>I don't see the correlation between expensive footwear and comfort.There is a close correlation, but only if you buy genuine leather shoes. Good leather gets into shape while you wear it. If the leather is really tough, it takes a while, but afterwards these shoes will fit as if they were made for you. There is nothing that can be as comfortable, IMHO. The feet are always dry, warm and comfortable.

The price is high, of course. Good leather costs a fortune (you want the one without chemicals in them). Repairing these shoes is expensive too. Find the right person who does it well, find the right brands, so you don't buy expensive fake, etc. pp.

I own many hand made pairs, none of them less then 400 Euros worth (some more). This is not frugal, this is luxury. But I have 20 year old pairs that still look great and can easily be worn to the opera or a concert (if that's your kind of occupation). Calculating the price per year is also pretty good value for money.

But I would never dispute that flip flops are cheaper ;o). If you loose them, if they are damaged, no problem. Investment is also always a commitment.

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#103

Post by jasonkester »

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #98
jasonkester wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, and I think that's what the author was saying too. One example: Craftsman Hand Tools. They have a lifetime guarantee, so provided you don't lose them, you're done buying screwdrivers and wrenches for life. True story. I walked into Sears with a broken socket wrench. Sears guy: "Wow. What happened to that ?" Me: "Well, I had a bolt that really didn't want to come loose, so I had a six foot cheater bar and I wa…

Along those lines, one of the purchases I am most happy with is notebook insurance -- the kind that covers me being a bonehead. My notebook computer is my main tool, without it I couldn't work. So when something happens, it's critical to be able to pick up the phone, dial a toll-free number, and have a new part or computer arriving very quickly by an overnight carrier. Saved my bacon many times.

Indeed:

Me: "My keyboard seems to have acquired this big fist-shaped dent, and now the spacebar doesn't work right."

Dell Onsite Rep: "Let me grab you a new one out of the truck."

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#104

Post by josefresco »

wyclif wrote: post #64
danssig wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the disconnect here is your use of the term frugal. In the US (at least the south) every time I've ever heard anyone say they were frugal they meant they were cheap. They would buy the cheapest possible thing and use it well past the point it was presentable. I've even heard such people claim the cheaper thing must be better quality because it's cheaper. Sadly, I'm not even exaggerating.

I'm from the NE, and the word "frugal" does not mean the same thing here as it does in the South. As someone above said about New England, frugal is an art form here. Frugal is spending more on Calphalon cookware because you don't waste a ton of money eating out 3x a week, and want cooking gear that lasts a lifetime so you don't have to spend more money re-buying cheap stuff later.

I can concur, being from New England myself frugal is looked at as a desirable trait. In fact, I'd say its synonymous with the term "thrifty" which is another positive association for us.

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#106

Post by marknutter »

I think it's perfectly acceptable to buy a cheap version of something if you're not sure how much you're going to be using it. For instance, if you decide to take up guitar, you'd be an idiot to spend $3000 on a nice Fender Stratocaster, because chances are you're going to play it for a week and then never touch it again. Same goes for a lot of hobbies. If you are going to use something a lot, however, I agree that you should eventually upgrade to the nicest stuff you can afford.

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#107

Post by gaustin »

ajkessler wrote: post #13
nicpottier wrote: post #3

On one hand I kind of agree with this, there certainly is something to be said for buying nice stuff now and then, especially when it is stuff you love doing. For play, I use a ratio I call the Fun Factor. Essentially, that's the $/hr of fun I get out of something. So if you go see a movie and it is $10, and it is the rare money that is actually fun to watch, then the fun factor is roughly $5. So then you apply it to…

I use the Fun Factor rationalization too, but I find it can be problematic in many cases. Mainly with bigger purchases. When you amortize that $2000 bike out per use, the difference between it and the $1500 bike can seem rather insignificant. "$1.5 v. $2 per use? Hell, I might as well get the better one." But, it's still $500. That's real money that could be used to earn more money somewhere else. Ratchet that up if…

I just bought a 260 lb. high quality anvil. It will be an excellent anvil for at least 200 years (if not 300 or 400 years).

How's that for longevity?

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#108

Post by larrik »

jasonkester wrote: post #61
yason wrote: post #24

I don't think that being frugal has ever been about going cheap. Frugality is not about consuming but investing in your life: that often contradicts with cheap. Frugality is about not buying things you don't need but buying things you can't live without. A frugal person will typically invest in quality because he knows he'll be using the item for years and doesn't want to replace it every few. I wouldn't consider mys…

Indeed, and I think that's what the author was saying too. One example: Craftsman Hand Tools. They have a lifetime guarantee, so provided you don't lose them, you're done buying screwdrivers and wrenches for life. True story. I walked into Sears with a broken socket wrench. Sears guy: "Wow. What happened to that ?" Me: "Well, I had a bolt that really didn't want to come loose, so I had a six foot cheater bar and I wa…

I've actually found ancient Craftsman tools in the yard, left over from the workers who built my house decades before, and Sears happily replaced them.

Of course, if Sears tanks in a few years, then those tools aren't such a good deal anymore.

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#109

Post by barefoot »

gaustin wrote: post #107
ajkessler wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use the Fun Factor rationalization too, but I find it can be problematic in many cases. Mainly with bigger purchases. When you amortize that $2000 bike out per use, the difference between it and the $1500 bike can seem rather insignificant. "$1.5 v. $2 per use? Hell, I might as well get the better one." But, it's still $500. That's real money that could be used to earn more money somewhere else. Ratchet that up if…

I just bought a 260 lb. high quality anvil. It will be an excellent anvil for at least 200 years (if not 300 or 400 years). How's that for longevity?

Did you buy new or used?

Re: Being Frugal Makes You A Loser

#110

Post by matwood »

mgarfias wrote: post #8
nicpottier wrote: post #3

On one hand I kind of agree with this, there certainly is something to be said for buying nice stuff now and then, especially when it is stuff you love doing. For play, I use a ratio I call the Fun Factor. Essentially, that's the $/hr of fun I get out of something. So if you go see a movie and it is $10, and it is the rare money that is actually fun to watch, then the fun factor is roughly $5. So then you apply it to…

My 2001 Z06 Corvette that I bought new in 2000. Hand tools only last forever if you don't use them; I beat the heck out of mine. I buy craftsman tools at sears, at least the basic hand tools. They replace them free when they break/wear out, no questions asked. For more complex tools (torque wrenches and the like), I spend the money and buy Snap-On (or equivalent). Other things I've spent money on (that I'm happy with…

Other things I've spent money on (that I'm happy with): heated slate floors for my bathroom - nothing like 85deg toasty floors when you get up in the morning; Benchmade knives; our latex foam mattress. Probably more things I can't think of at the moment.

If a person does any amount of cooking a nice set of knives is one of the best things a person can spend money on. They make preparing meals easier, faster and safer.

One thing that I have spent good money on is sheets. I spend 6-8 hours/day in bed sleeping so why not be as comfortable as possible?

I think frugal people also recognize the importance of good enough. One of the easiest places to see this in action is when buying wine. Going from the $5 bottle of wine to the $10-$20 bottle of wine often yields huge quality increases. When you start going from the $20 to $50 and $100+ the changes are often barely noticeable if at all. Most things that we buy have a similar scale and the key is finding that spot that is good enough for the best price.

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