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Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#481

Post by jedberg »

MaxHoppersGhost wrote: post #468
jedberg wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly did Apple do? The hired a contractor, and they just found out that contractor is using slave labor, so now they are investigating. The last time they found out a contractor was using slave labor, they severed the relationship. I'm not sure what else you'd expect them to do exactly.

I would expect one of the largest and most powerful companies in the world that is always virtue signaling to have their supply chain 100% slave free. That is not a big ask.

It's a pretty big ask actually. They have 1000s of suppliers. I'm sure their vetting process is pretty thorough already, and then they act swiftly when they find out something was missed. Feel reasonable to me.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#482

Post by njanirudh »

amelius wrote: post #478
arminiusreturns wrote: post #466

To the tune of Childish Gambinos "This is America": This is globalism This was always the point of offloading to other countries. Less regulations, lower wages, less powerful workers and workers unions, and higher profit margins. Ross Perot was right but nobody listened to him. Apple isnt unique, and this isnt the first time. Its systemic. So tired of the trope of accusing anybody critical of globalism of being an is…

Even if it's systemic, you could at least try to do something about it if you're one of the big guys. This is what I dislike most about Apple: they're trying to be a leader, but are not acting like one.

Apple is less of a leader and more of a mafia godfather

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#483

Post by matwood »

christophilus wrote: post #34

I’ve decided to leave the Apple ecosystem in 2021. But the problem is not isolated to Apple. In fact, I’d be surprised if other, cheaper products aren’t quite a bit worse. Is there an electronics company that does a better job? (That’s not a rhetorical question.)

Apple is one of the better ones in a sea of really bad. It's a low bar and certainly doesn't mean Apple is perfect. There might be some boutique phone makers who claim to be better like Librem or Fairphone, but because they have fewer resources than the big players it's much harder for them to really know.

And if you dig into the mining side of the rare earths, worker conditions drop quickly.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#485

Post by Judgmentality »

amelius wrote: post #478
arminiusreturns wrote: post #466

To the tune of Childish Gambinos "This is America": This is globalism This was always the point of offloading to other countries. Less regulations, lower wages, less powerful workers and workers unions, and higher profit margins. Ross Perot was right but nobody listened to him. Apple isnt unique, and this isnt the first time. Its systemic. So tired of the trope of accusing anybody critical of globalism of being an is…

Even if it's systemic, you could at least try to do something about it if you're one of the big guys. This is what I dislike most about Apple: they're trying to be a leader, but are not acting like one.

> This is what I dislike most about Apple: they're trying to be a leader, but are not acting like one.

How is Apple trying to be a leader in anything besides profits?

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#486

Post by stickfigure »

Nkuna wrote: post #235
tiahura wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm guessing you've never been incarcerated? There's all sorts of volunteering: such as fixing the TV or coffee maker, teaching other inmates to read, helping another inmate file a frivolous appeal, and so on. https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2017/07/20/538062911/wh... [What's It Really Like To Work In A Prison Goat Milk Farm? We Asked Inmates] But what do the workers themselves think? I find Jeremiah Pate in the…

> there is no "volunteer[ing]" in prison. >> "It's a great thing," Pate tells me. "It beats the alternative. Rather than sitting in your tiny little cell, you get to come out here." >> They were just thinking about their options in prison, and in that perspective, the farm looked pretty good. You're making the point of OP. When the only other option is "sitting in your tiny little cell", there's not much choice in it…

What are those other options? Take away the volunteer opportunity? Stop punishing people?

Just FYI, most of the non-prisoner firefighters in California are also volunteers. In my district (north Solano county), 90% of firefighters are volunteers. We don't get paid.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#487

Post by onethought »

arminiusreturns wrote: post #466

To the tune of Childish Gambinos "This is America": This is globalism This was always the point of offloading to other countries. Less regulations, lower wages, less powerful workers and workers unions, and higher profit margins. Ross Perot was right but nobody listened to him. Apple isnt unique, and this isnt the first time. Its systemic. So tired of the trope of accusing anybody critical of globalism of being an is…

It also spreads wealth. China lifted more people out of poverty than any nation in history, because of globalisation.

Are you saying poverty is less important than workers rights?

Economies develop. This is part of it. You’ve just had a “protectionist” President, US is worse off by almost every measure... as a counter example to your “protectionism is needed”

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#488

Post by [deleted] »

matwood wrote: post #483
christophilus wrote: post #34

I’ve decided to leave the Apple ecosystem in 2021. But the problem is not isolated to Apple. In fact, I’d be surprised if other, cheaper products aren’t quite a bit worse. Is there an electronics company that does a better job? (That’s not a rhetorical question.)

Apple is one of the better ones in a sea of really bad. It's a low bar and certainly doesn't mean Apple is perfect. There might be some boutique phone makers who claim to be better like Librem or Fairphone, but because they have fewer resources than the big players it's much harder for them to really know. And if you dig into the mining side of the rare earths, worker conditions drop quickly.

[deleted]

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#489

Post by heavyset_go »

onethought wrote: post #487
arminiusreturns wrote: post #466

To the tune of Childish Gambinos "This is America": This is globalism This was always the point of offloading to other countries. Less regulations, lower wages, less powerful workers and workers unions, and higher profit margins. Ross Perot was right but nobody listened to him. Apple isnt unique, and this isnt the first time. Its systemic. So tired of the trope of accusing anybody critical of globalism of being an is…

It also spreads wealth. China lifted more people out of poverty than any nation in history, because of globalisation. Are you saying poverty is less important than workers rights? Economies develop. This is part of it. You’ve just had a “protectionist” President, US is worse off by almost every measure... as a counter example to your “protectionism is needed”

Just so that we're on the same page, you're claiming that virtual slave prisoners are being lifted out of poverty through forced labor, correct?

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#490

Post by itsgrimetime »

arminiusreturns wrote: post #466

To the tune of Childish Gambinos "This is America": This is globalism This was always the point of offloading to other countries. Less regulations, lower wages, less powerful workers and workers unions, and higher profit margins. Ross Perot was right but nobody listened to him. Apple isnt unique, and this isnt the first time. Its systemic. So tired of the trope of accusing anybody critical of globalism of being an is…

I think “this is capitalism/liberalism” is a better way to call it out.

I am tired of the globalism/isolationism dichotomy that gets thrown around too, but there are good reasons to criticize attributing all of these problems to globalism. For one, “globalism” is commonly used as a racist dog whistle, and is a popular antisemitic conspiratorial buzzword. Second, calling out globalism as the root of the problem leaves out the fact that it’s capitalism that drives the need for globalism, not globalism existing just for the sake of globalism.

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