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Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#471

Post by the_local_host »

beaunative wrote: post #293

Forced labor is quite prevalent as state-sactioned punishment, and it is much better than other kinds of punishment that exist. I don't have problem with that, that's one way how legal system pays for itself rather than siphoning fund from tax-payers' money. The difficult part for me was how opaque the process is, how the Chinese government just put people in those "camps" without due process. It is worrisome and fra…

Is a "legal system that pays for itself" even desirable? Having revenue at all would seem to bring with it all kinds of terrible incentives.

Moreover if the full cost of incarceration is borne by the taxpayer, then everyone has an incentive to fix the underlying causes of imprisonment.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#472

Post by jiofih »

nobodyandproud wrote: post #270

I’ve minimized my consumption of meat over the years, because the way we treat animals in the factory farms is too cruel. It’s not perfect, because I eat dairy and eggs which introduce their own set of cruelty. Likewise, I’m severely disappointed by Apple. I’ve switched from Android to iPhone because I like Apple’s stance on privacy. I’m extremely bothered that Apple with its resource is not lobbying to change the pl…

What evidence of foul play have you seen from Apple specifically? The majority of suppliers for eg, Fairphone is also in China, and Apple has the most comprehensive transparency reports and controls of them all.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#474

Post by prox »

nobodyandproud wrote: post #440
cutemonster wrote: post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe you'd be interested in a Fairphone Another vegetarian here btw; I also didn't go all the way to becoming a vegan

When Arstechnica reviewed it last year, it was only available in Europe. I’ll keep a lookout. Edit: It’s manufactured in China, so there’s still a risk and it’s still supporting an authoritarian government.

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/tutorial-raspberry-pi-smartp...

Build your own smartphone!

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#475

Post by MaxHoppersGhost »

thepasswordis wrote: post #347
MaxHoppersGhost wrote: post #29

I hate how American (and European) companies will virtue signal with commercials and campaigns (Apple and Nike come to mind) toting their ESG credentials but then will be doing stuff like this. People fall for it and it really pisses me off. Welcome to marketing. It’s also crazy to me that China isn’t facing more severe backlash for the treatment of the Uyghurs. It’s reprehensible and disgusting.

The absolute most egregious example of this (imo) is Colin Kaepernick. He is literally paid by slavers . He is a multi-millionaire off of the profits of slave labor. It's disgusting that Nike is somehow putting forth a "woke" face while literally using slaves to build their products . Slavery is not woke. And Colin Kaepernick is a particular sort of disgusting that he is happy to accept millions of dollars from slave…

I was going to mention Kaepernick but decided not to to avoid the knee jerk downvotes. I agree but wouldn’t have used such strong language. It’s such a ridiculous double standard and I have friends that eat up the Kaerpernick marketing without thinking about it. I agree with Kaepernick’s message but the fact that Nike is backing him with that message is such a joke.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#476

Post by MaxHoppersGhost »

herbst wrote: post #118
MaxHoppersGhost wrote: post #29

I hate how American (and European) companies will virtue signal with commercials and campaigns (Apple and Nike come to mind) toting their ESG credentials but then will be doing stuff like this. People fall for it and it really pisses me off. Welcome to marketing. It’s also crazy to me that China isn’t facing more severe backlash for the treatment of the Uyghurs. It’s reprehensible and disgusting.

[flagged]

Uyghurs is a bipartisan issue not just a Trump thing (although it does play to his hand). Biden mentioned it a few times and I think even once in a debate.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#477

Post by throwaway3699 »

2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #173
mgh2 wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple fans don’t seem to care, as long as they are getting their magic, nothing else matters...

I'm not an Apple fan, probably more of an Apple hater, but why is Apple the bad guy for seeking cheaper labor? Why is it the consumers problem that China allows it's citizens to be treated like shit? Why is this ethical responsibility somehow always offloaded to the consumer?

Short of going to war (which isn't off the table), what is the long-term alternative?

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#478

Post by amelius »

arminiusreturns wrote: post #466

To the tune of Childish Gambinos "This is America": This is globalism This was always the point of offloading to other countries. Less regulations, lower wages, less powerful workers and workers unions, and higher profit margins. Ross Perot was right but nobody listened to him. Apple isnt unique, and this isnt the first time. Its systemic. So tired of the trope of accusing anybody critical of globalism of being an is…

Even if it's systemic, you could at least try to do something about it if you're one of the big guys.

This is what I dislike most about Apple: they're trying to be a leader, but are not acting like one.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#479

Post by drocer88 »

delecti wrote: post #40
LatteLazy wrote: post #12

I'm amazed the world isn't taking more action on China. Its quite sad really, 20 years ago, any one of the headlines from this year would have prompted sanctions and denunciations...

There's sadly a pretty long history of the international community ignoring atrocities as long as they're contained within a country. The answer to "why won't we recognize ?" is usually "because the victims were from the same country as the perpetrators".

Tibet, Mongolia and Turkestan, though occupied by past and current Chinese governments, are different countries than China.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#480

Post by Zarath »

throw_m239339 wrote: post #251
mrweasel wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I don’t understand is why companies want to be associated with these suppliers. Honestly the cost difference can’t be that big. Also why isn’t it news? It feels like something that should have journalists camping outside Tim Cooks office. While I question his motives, it’s kinda weird that Trump of all people seems to be the only one who is openly critical of China.

> What I don’t understand is why companies want to be associated with these suppliers. Honestly the cost difference can’t be that big. because ultimately the great majority of their customers do not care, as simple as that. They might care about local issues, wedge issues, but ethical and moral concerns in another country? not so much. Big luxury brands such as Apple pour billions in PR and marketing because they liv…

I think even more than that they simply do not have a choice. Yes, it sucks that Apple's suppliers are unethical, but what am I supposed to do if I want to Snapchat my girlfriend or talk to my friends, or have a phone that is compatible with itunes/apple music? If my choice is between Apple and Google, how do I know that Google's ethics are any better? Am I supposed to spend hours and hours of my life investigating whether one is marginally more ethical than the other?

We simply have to stop making consumers responsible and accountable for every unethical thing a company does. Why is the status quo that every company is evil and that's ok? You'll see AMEX commercials imploring you to "shop local" during the pandemic but where is their relief for small business? Why is it my responsibility to save them but business as usual for those that want to exploit me?

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