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Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#251
post #56

I fault companies like Apple for doing business with companies who do these things. But I'm not sure if anything changes if local governments aren't interested in stopping it (or actually support it) either. Markets don't care about human rights... and if the local government supports this (in this case China, but other places too). I don't see how this ever changes.

What I don’t understand is why companies want to be associated with these suppliers. Honestly the cost difference can’t be that big. Also why isn’t it news? It feels like something that should have journalists camping outside Tim Cooks office. While I question his motives, it’s kinda weird that Trump of all people seems to be the only one who is openly critical of China.

> What I don’t understand is why companies want to be associated with these suppliers. Honestly the cost difference can’t be that big.

because ultimately the great majority of their customers do not care, as simple as that. They might care about local issues, wedge issues, but ethical and moral concerns in another country? not so much. Big luxury brands such as Apple pour billions in PR and marketing because they live or die by the reputation. The day their customers start caring more about it, things might change.

I just want to add, that I'm no way trying to diminish Apple's achievements when it comes to technology, product integration and creating remarkable ecosystems. I cannot think of another manufacturer that nailed that much in so little time. I think that Apple Silicon is game changer. But yes, they are a luxury brand.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#252
post #9

"forced labor" It's slavery...modern day slavery. Why are we mincing words? We stand on our soap boxes and preach about historical injustices and how we need to repair them. Well here is your chance to prevent a future historical injustice, and all it takes is for you to take a stand, instead of quietly consuming the products and leaving it for future generations to atone for methods by which those products were prod…

> instead of quietly consuming the products The problem is the propertied capitalist class , not the working class. The capitalist class has the power. I appreciate your intention, yet it's super important to be clear that the problem is the bourgeoisie and the capitalist system, as the means of production are monopolized in their hands. The most advanced form through which the bourgeoisie (in this case Apple) exprop…

As an anti-capitalist, does it give you pause for thought that the Campaign for Accountability, which is behind this report, was co-founded by Louis Mayberg, the principal in a large investment management company.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#253
post #9

"forced labor" It's slavery...modern day slavery. Why are we mincing words? We stand on our soap boxes and preach about historical injustices and how we need to repair them. Well here is your chance to prevent a future historical injustice, and all it takes is for you to take a stand, instead of quietly consuming the products and leaving it for future generations to atone for methods by which those products were prod…

Forced Labor is considered a "Crime Against Humanity" and participants can be taken to a Court of International Law.

If Apple is a willing participant, I would imagine they could be dragged in front of the Hague.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#254
post #41
post #9

"forced labor" It's slavery...modern day slavery. Why are we mincing words? We stand on our soap boxes and preach about historical injustices and how we need to repair them. Well here is your chance to prevent a future historical injustice, and all it takes is for you to take a stand, instead of quietly consuming the products and leaving it for future generations to atone for methods by which those products were prod…

Equating slavery with forced labour belittles the gravity and awfulness of what actual slavery is (or was). Forced labour takes different forms, which includes forced paid work and by some definitions penal work. Slavery is when a person is treated as a property of another person. Being a slave may or may not involve forced labour. In addition, calling Uyghur work “slavery” in fact undermines the cause, allowing CCP…

That's why we have the definition of "modern slavery".

It could be interesting would journalists on the Gruniad have to give up using macs then.

"We rely on our suppliers sharing our values and complying with all laws at all times. We expect our business partners to treat people with dignity and respect and not to engage in practices associated with forced labor, even if not illegal in their location"

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#255
post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple fans don’t seem to care, as long as they are getting their magic, nothing else matters...

Apple is Foxconn's biggest customer. But why not call out PlayStation and Nintendo and Amazon and??? The fact is - Apple fans aren't unique. Not many people care about this issue, unfortunately.

That is why education on the issue is important.

This is an old documentary and a bit different demographic, but it is still pertinent. If people didn't care back then, I doubt they will this time though...

https://www.tvo.org/video/documentaries/complicit

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are kept in camps, monitored constantly, have no privacy, are searched constantly and on top of that, they are forced to work or go to detention. That is slavery. There's also the problem with them getting gutted for the organ transplants that China's own doctors have reported to be 4 times higher than they should be for the population size. So it is work, or go to detention and possibly get gutted.

What sources are you getting the organ transplants information from?

Here's one: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/china-forcefully-harvests...

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#257
post #196

I'm amazed the world isn't taking more action on China. Its quite sad really, 20 years ago, any one of the headlines from this year would have prompted sanctions and denunciations...

The problem is that Europe has no appetite for any sort of confrontation. Their leadership in peace and climate initiatives mask how little they're willing to do to address issues which have a potential body-bag cost. They have poured hundreds of billions of dollars every year into a dictatorship with no accountability and its military. And shifting all that industrial capacity out of Europe certainly made it look gr…

I've been pleased with how the EU has made progress with Iran. Maybe that plus brexit, Russia and refugees has been too much for them. We'll see I guess.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#258
post #133
post #9

"forced labor" It's slavery...modern day slavery. Why are we mincing words? We stand on our soap boxes and preach about historical injustices and how we need to repair them. Well here is your chance to prevent a future historical injustice, and all it takes is for you to take a stand, instead of quietly consuming the products and leaving it for future generations to atone for methods by which those products were prod…

Apple fans don’t seem to care, as long as they are getting their magic, nothing else matters...

This isn’t even concern trolling virtue signalling, this is you using human slavery to score internet tech superiority points by ... making up some fantasy strawman to sneer at.

And then try to claim you are different for using Google because you hate yourself at the same time.

Re: Apple’s longtime supplier accused of using forced labor in China

#259
post #81

I'm amazed the world isn't taking more action on China. Its quite sad really, 20 years ago, any one of the headlines from this year would have prompted sanctions and denunciations...

> I'm amazed the world isn't taking more action on China. Its quite sad really, 20 years ago, any one of the headlines from this year would have prompted sanctions and denunciations... Why would world politicians take any actions against China when so many of them do have a finger in the honeypot themselves? Invalidate stock shares* of all companies who made untold billions on China, and you will see that a huge doub…

> The reason why China is not Iraq now is that.

And nuclear weapons. Don't forget the elephant in the room. China has nukes, which severely limits the pressure the West can put on it.

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