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CIA vs. Wikileaks [video]

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Re: CIA vs. Wikileaks [video]

#101

Post by thatfunkymunki »

for_i_in_range wrote: post #99

He makes an important point early on in outlining the mission of Wikileaks centering on making Data and Information freely accessible to all (the concept of Dataism, for those who have read Yuval Harrari’s HOMO DEUS ). However, the processing of Information into Intelligence that can be acted upon is what characterizes Intelligence agencies. Wikileaks does not concern itself with this phase. Yet, the CIA’s Pompeo is…

Doesn't their editorial control over what they publish/don't publish push them further into intelligence agency territory?

Re: CIA vs. Wikileaks [video]

#102

Post by whatshisface »

for_i_in_range wrote: post #99

He makes an important point early on in outlining the mission of Wikileaks centering on making Data and Information freely accessible to all (the concept of Dataism, for those who have read Yuval Harrari’s HOMO DEUS ). However, the processing of Information into Intelligence that can be acted upon is what characterizes Intelligence agencies. Wikileaks does not concern itself with this phase. Yet, the CIA’s Pompeo is…

>However, the processing of Information into Intelligence that can be acted upon is what characterizes Intelligence agencies. Wikileaks does not concern itself with this phase. Yet, the CIA’s Pompeo is trying to paint a narrative that Wikileaks is doing this by labeling them a “non-state intelligence agency”, thereby justifying the CIA’s actions to attack Wikileaks.

Wait, think tanks, all political pundits, every newspaper with an opinion column, and everyone reading Hacker News processes information into intelligence. Who can't be targeted under this definition of a non-state intelligence agency?

Re: CIA vs. Wikileaks [video]

#103

Post by whatshisface »

thatfunkymunki wrote: post #101
for_i_in_range wrote: post #99

He makes an important point early on in outlining the mission of Wikileaks centering on making Data and Information freely accessible to all (the concept of Dataism, for those who have read Yuval Harrari’s HOMO DEUS ). However, the processing of Information into Intelligence that can be acted upon is what characterizes Intelligence agencies. Wikileaks does not concern itself with this phase. Yet, the CIA’s Pompeo is…

Doesn't their editorial control over what they publish/don't publish push them further into intelligence agency territory?

Only insofar as the Guardian's editorial control over the whistleblowing they publish pushes them into intelligence agency territory.

Re: CIA vs. Wikileaks [video]

#104

Post by whatshisface »

cochne wrote: post #100
for_i_in_range wrote: post #99

He makes an important point early on in outlining the mission of Wikileaks centering on making Data and Information freely accessible to all (the concept of Dataism, for those who have read Yuval Harrari’s HOMO DEUS ). However, the processing of Information into Intelligence that can be acted upon is what characterizes Intelligence agencies. Wikileaks does not concern itself with this phase. Yet, the CIA’s Pompeo is…

I think the true narrative is probably somewhere in the middle of those. Did WikiLeaks not strategically publish information for their desired political outcome?

People keep saying this, but never include the story. What's the meat behind the claim that they did this?

Re: CIA vs. Wikileaks [video]

#105

Post by woodruffw »

for_i_in_range wrote: post #99

He makes an important point early on in outlining the mission of Wikileaks centering on making Data and Information freely accessible to all (the concept of Dataism, for those who have read Yuval Harrari’s HOMO DEUS ). However, the processing of Information into Intelligence that can be acted upon is what characterizes Intelligence agencies. Wikileaks does not concern itself with this phase. Yet, the CIA’s Pompeo is…

I'm normally loathe to defend any aspect of the US MIC, but I think Pompeo's point is that Wikileaks knowingly publicizes information that has already been processed into Intelligence, and willfully turns a blind eye to its role as a laundromat for hostile powers under the guise of an ideology of totally free data.

I, for one, think that all information should be free. I think Pompeo's motivations are suspect and geopolitical and I don't trust him personally. However, I also think that Wikileaks has a myopic view of information freedom that chiefly benefits powers whose long term vision is the decline of liberal democracy.

Re: CIA vs. Wikileaks [video]

#106

Post by erdos4d »

Fnoord wrote: post #55
gonzo41 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The main advantage 'the man' has is organization and unit cohesion. Riots look fun on TV. and then you're in one. And you've only met these protesters casually a few times. Are you ready to take a beat down for them? And are you willing to fight hard against a tight unit like LEO or the military who have a lot more weapons to escalate with.

I believe a better question to ask yourself in such a situation is "Are you ready to avoid senseless violence?" ie. "is this worth it?" I don't believe is worth fighting police during a demonstration. I'm biased, sure, but still if you are in such situation you need to stop for a moment and think about such questions. Whenever I went to demonstrations -and, granted, its been a while since War in Iraq started- I made…

> I don't believe is worth fighting police during a demonstration.

As many protesters will tell you, in a lot of cases the police start the fight. Are you saying you're okay with them being able to just silence you? What do you propose doing when they use violence to shut down your protest?

Re: CIA vs. Wikileaks [video]

#107

Post by Kalium »

gruez wrote: post #97
roywiggins wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Heck, I've been quizzed this way by agents of the US while returning to the US, as a citizen , from abroad. What's your job, what did you do on your trip, how long was it. This was before I got on the plane, in a foreign airport. They aren't interested in the answer, they're interested in whether you have a ready answer and don't sound evasive.

>They aren't interested in the answer, they're interested in whether you have a ready answer and don't sound evasive. It doesn't seem too hard to remember the answers to four questions and practice it beforehand.

You're absolutely right, it doesn't seem difficult at all.

That said, have you ever had stage fright? It's pretty common. Practice often seems to melt away when an actual performance is at hand. With that in mind, it's perhaps not unreasonable to think that this particular bar - quite low as you rightly and wisely point out it seems to be - will trip up no few liars at scale.

Re: CIA vs. Wikileaks [video]

#108

Post by shadowgovt »

whatshisface wrote: post #104
cochne wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the true narrative is probably somewhere in the middle of those. Did WikiLeaks not strategically publish information for their desired political outcome?

People keep saying this, but never include the story. What's the meat behind the claim that they did this?

The New York Times did reporting on the WikiLeaks disclosure of the Clinton emails that suggested the timing indicated political motivation.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/27/us/politics/assange-timed...

Re: CIA vs. Wikileaks [video]

#109

Post by shadowgovt »

roywiggins wrote: post #81
conistonwater wrote: post #8

– (1) “Do you live in the UK?” / Alternative: “What is your occupation?” – (2) “How long do you stay?” – (3) “What do you do in the UK?” These are the questions I always get every time I cross any border anywhere except the border (on the way in) of my own country. I don't get this bit.

Heck, I've been quizzed this way by agents of the US while returning to the US, as a citizen , from abroad. What's your job, what did you do on your trip, how long was it. This was before I got on the plane, in a foreign airport. They aren't interested in the answer, they're interested in whether you have a ready answer and don't sound evasive.

My experience and the experience of some friends of mine has been that questioning as much more stringent entering the US than leaving the US.

in fact, I have a friend who took a day trip to Canada with no problem and then, upon attempting to reenter the United States, was blocked because she had not brought her passport. Canadian authorities had accepted her driver's license as sufficient proof of identity for entering their country; US authorities would not accept it for reentering her home country.

Re: CIA vs. Wikileaks [video]

#110

Post by erdos4d »

marrowgari wrote: post #80
roenxi wrote: post #2

One of several advantages military/policing/etc forces have is detailed records of what worked & what didn't in a confrontation, and the other doesn't even necessarily know that they are fighting. That and purpose-built gear which nearly goes without saying. Something I've noticed with the riots in Europe/America/China/the Middle East/Africa is that we now have first hand video footage of how situations play out. Oft…

The reason the 1% is able to utterly dominate the remaining 99% is they are hyper organized. They're even organized around the concept, idea, and execution of organization.

The fact that the most desperate of the 99% will take the 1%'s money to oppress the rest of the 99% has something to do with it. Put another way, I never once met a cop from the 1%.
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