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Starship / Super Heavy

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Re: Starship / Super Heavy

#61

Post by [deleted] »

doomlaser wrote: post #47
mabbo wrote: post #9

> The fully integrated Starship/Super Heavy launch vehicle will be approximately 400 feet tall and 30 feet in diameter. For reference, the Saturn V rocket from the Apollo program was 363 feet tall. It was 33 ft wide at the first stage, while Starship is 30 ft wide all the way to the top. It's just massive. And it's fully reusable. What a game changer.

I'm really interested in seeing how it will perform its "belly flop" landing. Seems like a high risk maneuver https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdTYMry7fq0#t=1m17s

[deleted]

Re: Starship / Super Heavy

#62

Post by sfblah »

electriclove wrote: post #12
jonplackett wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In another article about Tesla VW CEO described them as having ‘essentially unlimited resources’. I guess spaceX probably falls under a similar category. Unlimited resources + not wasting ANYTHING is a killer combo.

I think many others also have 'essentially unlimited resources' but it is the execution and quick iteration that is unique to both Tesla and SpaceX.

I don’t think you’re right about many others having unlimited resources. This situation is a novelty in the post-cold-war era. Admittedly in the Cold War military projects probably did have unlimited resources.

Re: Starship / Super Heavy

#63

Post by avmich »

gibolt wrote: post #40
mabbo wrote: post #9

> The fully integrated Starship/Super Heavy launch vehicle will be approximately 400 feet tall and 30 feet in diameter. For reference, the Saturn V rocket from the Apollo program was 363 feet tall. It was 33 ft wide at the first stage, while Starship is 30 ft wide all the way to the top. It's just massive. And it's fully reusable. What a game changer.

It is approximately a 30 storey building. The majority of it is filled with extremely dense liquid fuel. The ability to lift that into orbit (minus most fuel and booster) with both halves still able to land is an insane feat.

You mean, extremely cold. Not particularly dense, methane is about half of water density, oxygen is about 10% more.

Re: Starship / Super Heavy

#64

Post by flenserboy »

suyash wrote: post #45

Next level space age begins, sooner we will be on Mars.

While it will be fun to see humans on Mars, the really interesting stuff is further out. Where large lifters like this will really shine is in allowing automated mining factories to be sent to various space rocks in order to allow further, larger projects to be built in place. Musk has been piggybacking technologies to fund future projects — I don't see Mars as an endpoint for his vision, and Mars will be a cash sink instead of a cash generator for some time to come. Look for the next moneymaking (and project-fostering) step.

Re: Starship / Super Heavy

#65

Post by zaroth »

wongarsu wrote: post #53
sneak wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the environmental impact delta between a 12km launch and landing and an orbital launch and landing? I can't imagine the difference to the ground environment is that significant.

The Super Heavy Booster has an order of magnitude more engines than the Starship prototype that did the 12km hop. I don't think Starship can reach orbit without the booster (it can reach space, but not orbital velocity)

Sounds levels in particular will be extreme at launch (as in, deadly even outside the blast radius). And there's a lot more fuel that could potentially explode over populated areas on the way into orbit.

For this reason, I think the intent is for Superheavy launches to be mainly done far out at sea. But Boca is needed in the interim for testing purposes.

Re: Starship / Super Heavy

#66

Post by SECProto »

sneak wrote: post #46
zaroth wrote: post #3

The FAA recently updated this page as part of the new Environmental Assessment at Boca Chica which is required before SpaceX can be approved for orbital flights. Their current approval is good for testing (vertical) flights of Starship and Superheavy, but does not currently permit orbital flight from Boca Chica as I understand it. They are currently in a public comment period thru Jan 22.

What's the environmental impact delta between a 12km launch and landing and an orbital launch and landing? I can't imagine the difference to the ground environment is that significant.

In addition to the other comment (a lot more engines in the first stage of a full stack than the test hopper), there's also the impact of mishaps - an exploding fully fueled full stack would have dramatically larger impact than the partially-filled test hop.

Then there's he environmental impact of more frequent launches (originally the area was approved for 12 falcon 9 flights a year) - sound impacts on wildlife, habitat impact of larger construction areas, more staff around reduces habitat quality for wildlife, etc.

Re: Starship / Super Heavy

#67

Post by rtkwe »

TylerE wrote: post #58
doomlaser wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm really interested in seeing how it will perform its "belly flop" landing. Seems like a high risk maneuver https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdTYMry7fq0#t=1m17s

I guess the counterargument is that as long as you bring it down in a "safe" area, you don't really need a 100% success rate. If you can reuse it, great, if not, well, it's a rocket.

The belly flop is also how passenger variants will be landing so you do actually need a reliable program....

Re: Starship / Super Heavy

#68

Post by wolfram74 »

avmich wrote: post #63
gibolt wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is approximately a 30 storey building. The majority of it is filled with extremely dense liquid fuel. The ability to lift that into orbit (minus most fuel and booster) with both halves still able to land is an insane feat.

You mean, extremely cold. Not particularly dense, methane is about half of water density, oxygen is about 10% more.

Given most buildings are upwards of 90% air by volume, that's still quite dense.

Re: Starship / Super Heavy

#70

Post by divbzero »

mabbo wrote: post #9

> The fully integrated Starship/Super Heavy launch vehicle will be approximately 400 feet tall and 30 feet in diameter. For reference, the Saturn V rocket from the Apollo program was 363 feet tall. It was 33 ft wide at the first stage, while Starship is 30 ft wide all the way to the top. It's just massive. And it's fully reusable. What a game changer.

This factoid [1] may soon need an update.

[1]: https://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/world-records/largest-r... "Largest rocket"

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