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Voat Is Shutting Down

voat.co

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Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#411

Post by tpxl »

BrandoElFollito wrote: post #392
esperent wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can we discuss if overweight people should pay more for sits in a plane? Can we discuss if a trans male who identifies herself to be a woman should be allowed to take part in female sport competition (box, running)? I am afraid we no longer can discuss such "uncomfortable" topics You can debate those things on reddit without being censored on a lots of subreddits. However, the reason these are such contentious topi…

The examples @piokoch made are very good. Seats in planes were designed for average people. It means that myself, as an average person, have the right to be relatively comfortable in that chair. If an obese person sits next to me, I have nothing against them on a human level - but the fact that they use my space. They are not comfortable either (certainly physically and probably psychologically) so if we accept obese…

> The example in sports is a good one too. I think that we should not test anybody for anything because a sportman today is not a normal being anyway.

This would lead to a large number of injuries and overdoses because of the drug use. IIRC this was happening in soccer with heart attacks happening because of drugs.

The distinction between men and women teams is arbitrary but fairly sensible. If you didn't separate them then you'd have men at the top and women at the bottom, which does not fun make.

That said, I have no clue how to solve the transperson distinction in sports.

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#412

Post by ourcat »

aaron695 wrote: post #254
raldi wrote: post #84

Moderated communities beat unmoderated ones on any metric you can name. Always have, always will. Nobody wants to drink at a pub that won't throw out rude patrons.

Voat was moderated. No one designs forums that are un-moderated that I know of? Maybe newsgroups 25 years ago would fit. Community moderation is an interesting idea that I believe is still unsolved online.

Ahh NNTP. Those were indeed the days. As were the killfiles we used, to try and deal with an ever-increasing amount of spammers.

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#413

Post by 0dayz »

brayhite wrote: post #176
cbozeman wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its not that free speech platforms are destined to fail, its anonymity. You're not responsible for your words. That's why these fail. Notice I use my real name here on this website. Not a pseudonym. Whatever I say here, I would say to you in front of your face. Same as I do on Facebook and Twitter and Reddit and the other areas I post. I've always used my real name. I'll always use my real name. We don't require anyo…

This may have been true at one time, but in the age of Youtube videos and live broadcasts being a popular vehicle for all of the above, I don't think folks care anymore about anonymity. It's a toxic race for attention and engagement to either a.) generate revenue, b.) acquire some taste of "fame", or c.) both. Being anonymous plays a role in some corners of the internet, but the ones that are contributing the most to…

Anonymity plays a big role in supporting the public figures who "represent" toxic ideas. Since those anonymous supporters might at best amplify the message or at worst do raids to their public figure's enemies.

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#414

Post by input_sh »

intended wrote: post #82

Crap. The containment board is down. I never thought I would want to create a go fund me for voat . But if it keeps stuff contained in the long run?

They still have their own echo chambers. thedonald[.]win, Gab, and Parler come to mind.

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#415

Post by [deleted] »

fulafel wrote: post #275
raldi wrote: post #84

Moderated communities beat unmoderated ones on any metric you can name. Always have, always will. Nobody wants to drink at a pub that won't throw out rude patrons.

There have been some pretty successful unmoderated (centrally) social networks. Email, Usenet, IRC come to mind. The moderation does happen in these but it's self organizing.

[deleted]

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#416

Post by totony »

watwut wrote: post #393
totony wrote: post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Remember the holocaust I'd posit the words weren't the things affecting people, but whatever actions they took

By the time holocaust was going on, it was too late.

Are you saying without free speech it wouldn't have happened?

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#417

Post by MisterTea »

esperent wrote: post #328
piokoch wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but there is some middle ground between antisemitism and following what mainstream loves the a given point of time. And right now if someone dares to stick outside mainstream views this is considered hate speech, anti-XXX, etc. Can we discuss if overweight people should pay more for sits in a plane? Can we discuss if a trans male who identifies herself to be a woman should be allowed to take part in female sport…

> Can we discuss if overweight people should pay more for sits in a plane? Can we discuss if a trans male who identifies herself to be a woman should be allowed to take part in female sport competition (box, running)? I am afraid we no longer can discuss such "uncomfortable" topics You can debate those things on reddit without being censored on a lots of subreddits. However, the reason these are such contentious topi…

> ou did not bring them up in good faith, for example, you just used obese and trans people to make a point.

You are one of the people the gp is mentioning. Those two are excellent points. There are a lot of people who are uncomfortable with those topics but are open to discussing them. Then people like you come out of the woodwork and accuse them of some nonsensical uptight bullshit and crap on their legitimate questions. Your open hostility then further cements their oppositional opinions. Instead of progress towards understanding and accepting, they dig their heels in and stay hateful because you pretty much told them to fuck off.

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#418

Post by koffiezet »

tinus_hn wrote: post #349
tzs wrote: post #54

Most of the original Voat groups were groups that has been kicked off of Reddit, but then people there made groups that corresponded to groups that were still on Reddit, like /v/science and /v/movies. Reading those is quite an experience. On /v/science right now there is a submission about dark matter and MOND [1], which was also discussed today on HN [2]. The title of the Voat submission will give you a good idea of…

Question is where they will end up now that this forum is dead. They will find another one.

They already have Parler. Don't recommend going there, it's even more explicit in its toxicity... Also not public, for a reason I guess...

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#419

Post by yakireev »

pstuart wrote: post #237
yakireev wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they can do absolutely nothing to stop you from creating a competing community on the exact same website, leveraging the existing userbase. Admins can though. I see a recurring pattern of this in U.S. politics or politics-infested parts of reddit: mods of /r/PoliticalHumor or /r/MurderedByWords can make a pro-D. echo chamber out of their subreddits, but an attempt to make a pro-R. echo chamber of the similar temper…

I'm curious about this dissent you speak of. Could you share some examples of it that you have seen or would like to see? Edit: the question was asked in sincerity. I haven't seen any such dissent but I live in a bubble. The only conservative dissent I've seen in the last 4 years has been been republicans leaving the party over Trump.

Go to /r/all and try to find the first pro-T. post and the first "orange man bad" post. If you don't find any pro-T. posts quickly, then this is your example.

We know from the election results that about half of the U.S. voters prefer R. party or T. in particular. This is a lot - this can't be a fringe group by definition of "fringe".

In 2016, scrolling through reddit you could see it. There was a contested election, there were supporters from both sides on reddit, noisy and visible. In 2020, you'll be hard-pressed to find some pro-T. content unless you know where to look (I don't, and won't bother), it's all "orange man bad" now. He probably is, but come on.

So, reddit somehow shut off the half of its home country from participating in political discussion on their website. They're probably in their own right, but this is scary shit.

Re: Voat Is Shutting Down

#420

Post by inglor_cz »

watwut wrote: post #400
inglor_cz wrote: post #397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if bluntness only equals useful truth for a minority of times, it is still worth it. Truth is a rare and important commodity, much like gold is. You would not throw away a mineral that has "only" a few per cent gold as useless, only because non-gold forms the bulk of it.

Nah, there are plenty of truthful things around. My point is, being jerk should not be equated with truth and people who are not jerks pretty often don't lie.

It should not be equated to truth, no.

My point is, the most valuable insights regarding myself and my behavior came from people who were willing to be blunt with me. I would be a worse person today if I never heard some of the observations that made me swallow hard and even get angry.

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