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Jaywalking decriminalization, 100 years after the auto industry made it a crime

virginiamercury.com

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Re: Jaywalking decriminalization, 100 years after the auto industry made it a crime

#31

Post by jgwil2 »

GhostVII wrote: post #20
erulabs wrote: post #11

Seeing as encounters with law enforcement are probably more deadly on average than jaywalking - I wholly support this change. Being poor in a car city is something most folks in the circles I run in now have never experienced or thought about. The documentary “Los Angeles Plays Itself” has a fantastic section about this.

> Seeing as encounters with law enforcement are probably more deadly on average than jaywalking There are far more instances of jaywalking than police interactions, and yet pedestrian deaths are 6x higher than deaths from police. So no that is not true in any way, especially when you account for armed vs unarmed police shootings (~25 unarmed black people were shot and killed by police in 2019, where unarmed includes…

"Pedestrian deaths" does not equal "deaths caused by jaywalking."

> There are far more instances of jaywalking than police interactions, and yet pedestrian deaths are 6x higher than deaths from police.

The first assertion actually cuts against your argument. If there are far more instances of jaywalking than police encounters, then even if there are many more deaths caused by jaywalking, police encounters could still be deadlier on a per-instance basis.

Re: Jaywalking decriminalization, 100 years after the auto industry made it a crime

#32

Post by booleandilemma »

msla wrote: post #26

> Before the advent of the automobile, pedestrians in America were widely recognized as having the right of way in all situations. OK, let's go back to this. You can argue right-of-way with a ton of fiberglass and steel going 35 mph. Tell us all how that works out for you. Placing blame doesn't mean anything when the laws of physics dictate which one's going to be the winner in any given scenario.

Might doesn't make right.

Re: Jaywalking decriminalization, 100 years after the auto industry made it a crime

#33

Post by jonplackett »

umvi wrote: post #21

Jaywalking drives me crazy... sometimes I wish American culture was more German/Japanese in this area and Americans walked the extra 20 feet to the nearest crosswalk and waited for the light. A few times now I've had to tap my brakes for some guy dashing across the street to the island in the middle because he was too impatient to wait for the light to change. Sometimes it's a lady with a shopping cart. These aren't…

In lots of places cities are actually built for pedestrians not motorists. Some of us prefer it that way.

Re: Jaywalking decriminalization, 100 years after the auto industry made it a crime

#34

Post by marricks »

umvi wrote: post #21

Jaywalking drives me crazy... sometimes I wish American culture was more German/Japanese in this area and Americans walked the extra 20 feet to the nearest crosswalk and waited for the light. A few times now I've had to tap my brakes for some guy dashing across the street to the island in the middle because he was too impatient to wait for the light to change. Sometimes it's a lady with a shopping cart. These aren't…

Many US cities are designed to be downright hostile to pedestrians, California in particular. Some areas in Orange County have blocks before cross walks, or cross walks only on one side of the street so you had to make the right decision a block ago about which side of the street to be on! Strip malls seemed designed to have people drive the 1k feet between businesses rather than having accessible walking. With city planning focused on driving you start to realize why pedestrians can behave so badly?

If you're talking specifically about urban cities, I still bet Japan/Germany have been urban planning for sidewalks which encourages "good behavior".

Re: Jaywalking decriminalization, 100 years after the auto industry made it a crime

#35

Post by strictnein »

msla wrote: post #19
hk__2 wrote: post #14

This is what I get from France: > This site not available in your country I wonder what makes that website so special it can’t comply with GDPR.

I wonder what makes Europe so special it can demand companies outside of Europe comply with European law.

It can't.

A lot of local US press seems to have gotten bad legal advice.

Re: Jaywalking decriminalization, 100 years after the auto industry made it a crime

#36

Post by majormajor »

msla wrote: post #26

> Before the advent of the automobile, pedestrians in America were widely recognized as having the right of way in all situations. OK, let's go back to this. You can argue right-of-way with a ton of fiberglass and steel going 35 mph. Tell us all how that works out for you. Placing blame doesn't mean anything when the laws of physics dictate which one's going to be the winner in any given scenario.

Maybe that's not a place the vehicle should be going 35mph, then.

Maybe the vehicle should be smaller, instead of ever-larger SUVs and trucks.

Maybe there should be crosswalks and signals.

There's nothing in the laws of physics that dictate that roads should be hard to cross on foot, and that cars should move at their current speeds, and be designed the ways they are. Those are all choices.

Re: Jaywalking decriminalization, 100 years after the auto industry made it a crime

#37

Post by nickff »

rafram wrote: post #6
nodesocket wrote: post #2

“encounters with the police, especially for people of color.” Huh? How is enforcing people not dart out into streets and hit by cars racist or biased?

It’s a minor crime which people of color tend to be disproportionately cited for.

It looks like non-hispanic whites have much lower rates of pedestrian deaths than other demographics, this indicates that other groups are likely walking in riskier areas, or in more dangerous ways, and may explain some of the 'disparity in ticketing'.

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6939a7.htm

Re: Jaywalking decriminalization, 100 years after the auto industry made it a crime

#39

Post by hmottestad »

msla wrote: post #19
hk__2 wrote: post #14

This is what I get from France: > This site not available in your country I wonder what makes that website so special it can’t comply with GDPR.

I wonder what makes Europe so special it can demand companies outside of Europe comply with European law.

Probably because advertisement on webpages pay out regardless of if I as a European click on it.

Re: Jaywalking decriminalization, 100 years after the auto industry made it a crime

#40

Post by castlecrasher2 »

umvi wrote: post #21

Jaywalking drives me crazy... sometimes I wish American culture was more German/Japanese in this area and Americans walked the extra 20 feet to the nearest crosswalk and waited for the light. A few times now I've had to tap my brakes for some guy dashing across the street to the island in the middle because he was too impatient to wait for the light to change. Sometimes it's a lady with a shopping cart. These aren't…

Same here. In Utah, if there's a 4-way intersection, pedestrians always have right of way and police enforce it. I was pulled over for not yielding on a 45 MPH road and when the officer asked "do you know why I pulled you over?" I sincerely had no idea.

I think I understand the intent of the law but I guess my own philosophy of "cross where you're far less likely to die" isn't the legal one.

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