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All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

theguardian.com

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Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#291

Post by tharkun__ »

bonoboTP wrote: post #272
raziel2p wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did you know that XorNot replied to your previous comment? Notifications, addictive design and gamification are really bad practices that we should try to avoid - but the underlying drug of social media is that someone noticed and reacted to your content, and HN provides that just like Facebook or Twitter.

Most people on here and Reddit are lurkers. They still keep coming back even though the see no tasty upvotes.

I think all three of you are actually hitting the nail on the head. Large headed nail I suppose ;) Take ne as an example. I could've had a really low user number on Slashdot if I had registered right away. I never actually did but I read Slashdot for many many many years.

I turn off notifications on my phone for almost any app. It's just way too annoying. I'll get to it when I get to it! I guess I'm part of that minority mentioned above but as you say I do keep coming back too. It's not black and white but we can stay on the healthy side.

If I try to find an analogy, it's the difference between sitting by the fire in the evening and chatting with other people vs. spending the entire day running around listening to and actively spreading rumors.

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#292

Post by chris_st »

hilbert42 wrote: post #244
mobilemidget wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always find this percentages puzzling. I reckon people busy thinking are too busy, or simply never get requested to fill in surveys about how they spend their idle CPU brain time. Thinking is the last remaining freedom, as long as you don't say all the things you think of out loud. :)

"Thinking is the last remaining freedom, as long as you don't say all the things you think of out loud." Absolutely, right on both accounts. (Occasionally swearing under my breath sometimes gives the game away.)

That's one of the unmentioned beauties of being a programmer... you can swear all you want, and people just think your code won't compile :-)

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#293

Post by tectonicfury »

hohenheim wrote: post #270
tectonicfury wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Muslim, I pray five times a day, and of late I have begun to perform it "better", as in unshackling myself from worldly thoughts and other mental distractions. I attach zero importance to them and I remind myself that this صلاة (prayer) that I am doing alone deserves any importance, to the exclusion of all others. Thoughts used to come to me to try and induce panic in me, but overtime they have become so feeble…

I don't think what Pascal is trying to get through is that we should numb ourself to inner thoughts. On the contrary, to acknowldege them and if anything, spend more time contemplating. That is when we can learn about ourself, others, and the universe, if I may say. Working from home this entire year, I have tried to practice taking at least 15 minutes everyday, couple of times a day, laying down and just listening t…

Pascal is throwing light and expounding upon a weakness found in (most) people, that of depending on distractions to prevent themselves from dwelling on thoughts which remind them of their mortal nature.

I didn't read his works enough, none apart from the above quote in fact, to comment on whether or not he recommends acknowledging our inner thoughts and contemplating on them.

As for me, I feel real and lasting relief from worshipping Allaah. It's something very tangible and enlightening. It might seem counterintuitive, but it does boost my productivity a lot, even though I ignore thinking about work during prayer.

Now, having belief in Allaah has its manifest benefits. I am happy as I write this. I am able to keep afloat a bit in trying times. I was able to come out of depression (and quite a few other mental illnesses). None of it I could achieve except by Allaah's help.

When I used to go to hospital for psychiatric treatment, the doctor used to advise me that whenever I feel anxious, I lie down on a bed, relax and think of some beautiful place, in order to ward off the bad feelings. So, even the best advice the doctor could give me was this.

And what better place to think of than Paradise?

What Pascal was explicit in saying is that there is no inherent happiness in material possessions. But if you know that there is a life after death, that there is a Paradise and a Hell, that there is a Merciful God who, if you believe in Him and obey Him, will reward you for you good deeds and forgive your bad deeds, you will be humble, you will be hopeful, and you will be happy.

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#296

Post by kodah »

maggotbrain wrote: post #141
wpietri wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That has a lot of resonance for me. In this modern age, we are all kings, and there are vast industries to save us from ever being alone from our thoughts. For December, I quit sugar, social media, and video games. It's been really interesting to notice what state I'm in when I go to reach for those things. Sometimes it's just habit, but often it's because I'm uncomfortable or in distress and want to avoid those feel…

If you are commenting here, you haven't really quit "social media".

People have tried to define what social media is. Rather than responding immediately I tried to think about what makes places like Facebook and Twitter so toxic.

For some context I don't consider things like forums to be social media. As an early internet denizen I had lots of thoughtful discourse with folks that reminds me of what I experience at HN. I continue to use IRC, which I also don't consider to be social media.

So what makes them different? I think it's the underlying technology. The graph, our ability to search it and correlate immediate (mostly irrelevant) commonality is what makes things dangerous.

Humans are full of dumb or awful thoughts. They'll combat these ideas or thoughts with alternatives regularly which end up referring to as cognitive dissonance. The result is that these lesser ideas widdle away or drop off completely. On social media, the graph doesn't forget and continues to tie you to people, ideas, and thoughts that are increasingly useless. While this sells ads and generates interest in new products it doesn't align well to the way humans have discourse, socialize, or just relate in general.

That to say, HN isn't social media to me.

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#297

Post by throw0101a »

wpietri wrote: post #105
codechicago277 wrote: post #50

This quote comes from Blaise Pascal's Pensées, accessible here. "That is why we like noise and activity so much. That is why imprisonment is such a horrific punishment. That is why the pleasure of being alone is incomprehensible. That is, in fact, the main joy of the condition of kingship, because people are constantly trying to amuse kings and provide them with all sorts of distraction.—The king is surrounded by peo…

That has a lot of resonance for me. In this modern age, we are all kings, and there are vast industries to save us from ever being alone from our thoughts. For December, I quit sugar, social media, and video games. It's been really interesting to notice what state I'm in when I go to reach for those things. Sometimes it's just habit, but often it's because I'm uncomfortable or in distress and want to avoid those feel…

> In this modern age, we are all kings, and there are vast industries to save us from ever being alone from our thoughts.

Ignatius Loyola, founder of the Jesuit religious order, set up a daily ritual to help keep himself (and those in the order) centred:

> To help me remember the five steps, I like to use a 5-Rs mnemonic:

> Relish the moments that went well and all of the gifts I have today.

> Request the Spirit to lead me through my review of the day.

> Review the day.

> Repent of any mistakes or failures.

> Resolve, in concrete ways, to live tomorrow well.

* https://www.loyolapress.com/catholic-resources/ignatian-spir...

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiritual_Exercises_of_Ignatiu...

If you go online you can probably find a Jesuit retreat centre not too far from you where you can spend (say) eight days in total silence and seclusion; you can optionally (though recommended) talk with a spiritual director once a day to help you sort through anything that bubbles up during your stay.

The BBC had a short doc where a bunch of random men and women went through the exercise (episodes are available online if you search):

* https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2117584/

Perhaps worthwhile, even if that is not your particular worldview.

(This is separate than what monks do, which is seclusion from the world.)

Most faiths in the world have spiritual traditions where silence and reflection are done. Probably possible to find similar retreat centres following their traditions. It seems that it is only the modern secular worldview that hasn't adopted something (yet?). I think this is something most modern philosophical worldviews (especially in the materialist bend) overlook: human 'spiritually' (for lack of a better word).

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#298

Post by nottorp »

MaxBarraclough wrote: post #245
gambiting wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"From my perspective, HN isn't really designed for addiction in the same way." I mean, it's fine that you feel this way, and you are probably correct - it wasn't designed for it. But I suspect for a lot of us , me included, it serves that exact purpose. I post so that strangers on the internet read it and give me likes. I compulsively check my comments section on my account to see how many upvotes my comments have. E…

> clearly upvote/downvote system didn't happen by an accident, it's there for a reason It encourages and prominently displays good quality comments, and discourages and buries poor quality comments. It's not a perfect system as a lot of people vote based on whether they happen to agree rather than based on a comment's quality, but it's much better than nothing.

> It encourages and prominently displays good quality comments, and discourages and buries poor quality comments. It's not a perfect system as a lot of people vote based on whether they happen to agree rather than based on a comment's quality, but it's much better than nothing.

Mostly. There is an unconscious hive mind on HN too, and it downvotes when you disagree with it. It just happens that most commenters belong to it, at least most of the time.

Re: All problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone (2014)

#300

Post by throwaway316943 »

tectonicfury wrote: post #279
throwaway316943 wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> -1 deg celcius on an empty stomach Sounds like a walk in the park for an ascetic. We forget how comfortable we’ve become, 250 years ago this would have been your average Tuesday.

Show us an ascetic who would find this a walk in the park.

Everyone born before 1600? Or maybe anyone who has done winter survival training. Hunger and cold have been with us since the beginning. The spiritual and meditative practices we’re talking about here were developed when these things were just daily facts of life and like other animals we’re adapted to deal with them as a matter of course. Modern humans live lives of luxury unknown to even the wealthiest and most fortunate people in the past. If you want a concrete modern example I’d offer Wim Hof.
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