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Stanford apologizes after vaccine allocation leaves out medical residents

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Re: Stanford apologizes after vaccine allocation leaves out medical residents

#191

Post by jedberg »

davidf560 wrote: post #24
amb23 wrote: post #12

The labor of medical residents is something hospital systems exploit during normal times, but that exploitation has severely deepened during the pandemic. At the hospital my partner works at, respiratory therapists and nurses got a $10k bonus for working during COVID; the residents got nothing despite working insane hours in ICU, routinely working more than the legally mandated 90 hours per week. Just because doctors…

> I can name 3 other local hospital systems in my city that have vaccinated administrative & C-suite/VP level staff I don't understand why society is putting up with this. Right now if you're not in a daily COVID-facing role (i.e. an actual front line medical worker) or in a nursing home you should not be getting the shot. This makes my blood boil. There should have been laws passed regarding ordering of the distribu…

Congress is legally mandated to get it first, a policy that has been in place since Eisenhower:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_federal_governme...

Of course it is unlikely that congress would ever change that law...

Re: Stanford apologizes after vaccine allocation leaves out medical residents

#192

Post by strombofulous »

joe_the_user wrote: post #173
edoceo wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And all is plebs do is comment on their actions. If they have no consequences why would they stop screwing us?

Yep, Stanford resident acted. Health care workers at those other hospitals are apparently silent. That makes the difference.

Did it make a difference? They apologized after using many of the vaccines and promised "to make a change". The promise is incredibly vague and won't likely come into effect until after most of the vaccines have been given out. It means nothing

Re: Stanford apologizes after vaccine allocation leaves out medical residents

#193

Post by adrianmonk »

jrochkind1 wrote: post #15

> "[A]lgorithms are made by people and the results ... were reviewed multiple times by people," You got that right. The way they talk about "an algorithm did it" makes it seem as as if they think that somehow explains it, like there was only one algorithm possible handed down from god or something. We'll be seeing more and more of this of course. "We can't be blamed, it was an algorithm! We can't be blamed for trusti…

The most charitable interpretation is that they're admitting they failed, but saying where they failed is in basic due diligence of looking at the output of running the algorithm. And that they're claiming that, if they had done so, they wouldn't have been OK with it either.

It's sort of like saying, "That's definitely a bug. It was unacceptable for me to put my code into production without ever testing it, and for that I take the blame. But I assure you that I did not intentionally write code designed to delete everyone's data."

Obviously this may or may not be what happened. It may even be what they're pretending happened.

Re: Stanford apologizes after vaccine allocation leaves out medical residents

#194

Post by [deleted] »

ishjoh wrote: post #61
beamatronic wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Select * From employees sort by salary desc

Small nit-pic. select * from employees sort by total_compensation desc; Otherwise C Level folks who take a $1 salary but receive tons of options would be put at the bottom.

[deleted]

Re: Stanford apologizes after vaccine allocation leaves out medical residents

#195

Post by WalterBright »

asddubs wrote: post #189
WalterBright wrote: post #188

Under a capitalist system, resources are allocated to those most willing to pay for it. Under a socialist system, resources are allocated to those with the most political power. Under an anarchist system, resources are allocated to those with the most firepower. The vaccine is being distributed under a socialist system. Nobody should be surprised at the results.

didn't know stanford was located in a socialist country, or does it have an anti-capitalism force field around it?

The distribution of vaccines is under the control of the government. There are none for sale, and in fact those in charge have adamantly said they wouldn't be selling vaccines.

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-12-18/wealthy-...

So yeah, socialism :-)

Re: Stanford apologizes after vaccine allocation leaves out medical residents

#196

Post by chaostheory »

asddubs wrote: post #189
WalterBright wrote: post #188

Under a capitalist system, resources are allocated to those most willing to pay for it. Under a socialist system, resources are allocated to those with the most political power. Under an anarchist system, resources are allocated to those with the most firepower. The vaccine is being distributed under a socialist system. Nobody should be surprised at the results.

didn't know stanford was located in a socialist country, or does it have an anti-capitalism force field around it?

While Stanford is a private entity, it acts and is structured like a public one. Even its full time employees aren’t at will like the private sector at large.

We can argue about whether or not Stanford is “socialist”, but I don’t feel he’s wrong that Stanford allocated vaccines according to political power. He also doesn’t judge any system. He’s just giving an observation

Re: Stanford apologizes after vaccine allocation leaves out medical residents

#197

Post by chaostheory »

1-6 wrote: post #7
mmastrac wrote: post #3

The great thing about an algorithm is that when it gives you results that benefit you, you can accept them and then pass the buck on to it when people get outraged: "According to an email sent by a chief resident to other residents, Stanford's leaders explained that an algorithm was used to assign its first allotment of the vaccine. The algorithm was said to have prioritized those health care workers at highest risk…

An algorithm is clearly a virtual scapegoat. They’ll need to interview those who were involved in coding it. Dig deeper to find out why.

The people “coding it” are probably following requirements usually set by HR and upper management. Not sure about Stanford hospitals, but in most orgs HR is usually the lead department when it comes to COVID-19 protocols.

Re: Stanford apologizes after vaccine allocation leaves out medical residents

#198

Post by neolog »

WalterBright wrote: post #188

Under a capitalist system, resources are allocated to those most willing to pay for it. Under a socialist system, resources are allocated to those with the most political power. Under an anarchist system, resources are allocated to those with the most firepower. The vaccine is being distributed under a socialist system. Nobody should be surprised at the results.

It may have just been a software bug, but which of those three options would have been your preference? Or some fourth option?

Re: Stanford apologizes after vaccine allocation leaves out medical residents

#199

Post by almost_usual »

If this pandemic has shown anything it’s that the poor and front line is throwaway.

Inequality in the US is getting more and more extreme. This shit will not be tolerated much longer, riots will get worse, people will get angrier.

Re: Stanford apologizes after vaccine allocation leaves out medical residents

#200

Post by BurningFrog »

jrochkind1 wrote: post #34
fairity wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think most people are misunderstanding the likely root cause. > An algorithm was used to assign its first allotment of the vaccine. The algorithm prioritized health care workers at highest risk for COVID infections, along with factors like age and the location or unit where they work in the hospital. Residents did not have an assigned location, and along with their typically young age, they were dropped low on the…

I don't think I was assuming anything in particular about the intents. it's a rather important thing not to check on actual data, including residents in the sample, isn't it? they just never bothered to test the algorithm, didn't even review the results it spit out, before delivering the results as a plan? (it is quite possible indeed they didn't, I'm not saying that is a coverup for some other motive, I'm saying tha…

It's a software bug, by an organization that doesn't normally produce software.

They've agreed it's wrong, and intend to fix it.

Send like a very average Thursday to me!

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