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Ultra-processed foods and the corporate capture of nutrition

bmj.com

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Re: Ultra-processed foods and the corporate capture of nutrition

#111

Post by stronglikedan »

dragontamer wrote: post #55
watwut wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If half of our food is ultraprocessed, then that's a problem with the definition of ultraprocessed. Why? Just because we consume a lot of it does not mean it is not "ultraprocessed". We should be afraid of a name just because a lot of modern food falls into the definition.

* Are there bad foods that are ultraprocessed? (Ex: Frosted Flakes) * Are there good foods that are ultraprocessed? (Ex: Grain Berry) * Are there good foods that are unprocessed? (Ex: Brown Rice) * Are the bad foods that are unprocessed? (Ex: Pork Belly) If "ultraprocessed" fails to distinguish good from bad, then the word itself is worthless.

One of the bad parts of processed (and by extension, ultraprocessed) foods is that (depending on the food, of course) a lot of the nutritional value is stripped out during the industrial preparation processes. This leads to the body feeling less satiated by the same amount of unprocessed food, and leads to overeating. For instance, boiling veggies instead of steaming them, because it's more efficient, and then discarding the water that the nutrients leached into.

Re: Ultra-processed foods and the corporate capture of nutrition

#112

Post by senkora »

ev1 wrote: post #87
jasode wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>, but in my experience most people prefer these foods because they think it's more convenient. [...] Everyone should learn how to cook some boring, staple meals using basic ingredients from the store. It's amazing how many people don't know how easy and cheap it can be to prepare simple crock pot or stir-fry meals that are healthy and delicious. I'm a strict health food eater but I have to be realistic and concede t…

Disappointingly, some people quite literally cannot cook - I don't have a stove. This is a lot more common[0] than one might think, and arguably hits the worst demographic for it - university students and fresh out of university students, where the only affordable place is $2-3k for barely a hundred square feet with a microwave and minifridge. There is a fair amount of places near tech companies where it's quite comm…

Dorms usually ban them, but for everyone else you can buy single induction burners relatively cheaply for cooking. Instant pots and similar products are another compact alternative.

When I was a student, I did a fair amount of cooking in shared kitchens in dorms, mainly because I enjoyed it and it helped me relieve stress. My goto strategy was to pick an unpopular time (middle of the week during the day, ideally) and meal prep for 2-3 hours, then mix those meals in with restaurant/cafeteria meals for the next week. I was able to make that work reasonably well.

Re: Ultra-processed foods and the corporate capture of nutrition

#113

Post by dragontamer »

dcolkitt wrote: post #109
dragontamer wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My issue with this "processing" designation is that its meaningless once we enter practice. > But the reality is that 99% of processing is directed at making foods hyper-palatable, calorically dense, and easy to digest. Because that's what consumers crave. Yes, people want unhealthy foods. You can buy a perfectly organic, fully unprocessed meal from Panda Express. Its called rice stir-fry, and as long as you hold bac…

> You can buy a perfectly organic, fully unprocessed meal from Panda Express. Its called rice stir-fry, Butter, sesame/vegetable oil and white rice are all processed foods. An unprocessed version would consist of brown rice, eggs, and the chopped veggies. Which would be an improvement on 95% of the typical meals Americans consume. I do get your point though. There's an aspect of Goodhart's law here. When we come up w…

> Butter, sesame/vegetable oil and white rice are all processed foods.

The article is clearly using NOVA's definition of unprocessed vs ultraprocessed. Under NOVA's definition of unprocessed: butter, vegetable oil are "Group 2" (ingredients) while white rice is "Group 1" (unprocessed / minimally processed).

--------

As such, fresh Stir Fry from a restaurant with white rice, oil, and butter is Group2.

Group3 and Group4 are the "problematic" (allegedly) groups of high-processing.

Re: Ultra-processed foods and the corporate capture of nutrition

#114

Post by UnFleshedOne »

dcolkitt wrote: post #93
jasode wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>, but in my experience most people prefer these foods because they think it's more convenient. [...] Everyone should learn how to cook some boring, staple meals using basic ingredients from the store. It's amazing how many people don't know how easy and cheap it can be to prepare simple crock pot or stir-fry meals that are healthy and delicious. I'm a strict health food eater but I have to be realistic and concede t…

> Yes, cooking healthy may be "easy" but it's still more work than junk food. One advantage of intermittent fasting is that it's much less burdensome to make a single, large healthy than it is to make three healthy meals plus snacks. (Though this can be a double-edge sword. If you wind up eating junk food, like pizza, for your large meal, then it becomes the equivalent of eating junk food for breakfast, lunch and din…

Who the hell makes 3 meals a day anyway? Unless you include reheating something prepared in bulk several days ago in that count?

Re: Ultra-processed foods and the corporate capture of nutrition

#115

Post by jeffreyrogers »

jasode wrote: post #50
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #12

This statistic from the article is mind-boggling: > Ultra-processed products now account for nearly half of the average dietary intake of some high income countries, with consumption rising rapidly in most other countries. Note that they aren't just referring to processed foods. They classify ultra-processed foods as a step beyond what we typically think of as processed foods: > Ultra-processed foods and beverages ca…

>, but in my experience most people prefer these foods because they think it's more convenient. [...] Everyone should learn how to cook some boring, staple meals using basic ingredients from the store. It's amazing how many people don't know how easy and cheap it can be to prepare simple crock pot or stir-fry meals that are healthy and delicious. I'm a strict health food eater but I have to be realistic and concede t…

If you have an instant pot, air fryer, and a microwave you can cook a healthy meal in 15 minutes. That's what I do when I got home from work most days: cook some rice in the instant pot, chop up some meat and cook it in the air fryer, and steam some vegetables in the microwave. Sure, it's not as fast as heating up a burrito or something, but it's not that much longer either and once you've done it a few times you can just do it on auto-pilot.

Re: Ultra-processed foods and the corporate capture of nutrition

#116

Post by acuozzo »

inglor_cz wrote: post #104

Just by comparing photos and videos from the 1980s to the situation in the streets now, it is painfully obvious that we (and by "we" I mean at least half of humanity) have a serious obesity and metabolic syndrome problem. It is breathtaking how civilized nations silently accept such an enormous slide in quality of life, when other, much smaller problems lead to civic unrest, political discussions and overhaul of old…

(Please forgive the scattered reply. I'm tired and I've mostly pieced this together from other discussions I've had on this topic.)

I firmly believe that the problem stems from a mass unspoken refusal to address obesity as a symptom of food addiction.

Food addiction is among the hardest to kick because humans not only need food to survive, but also need glucose (and/or ketone bodies) in order to have sufficient mental energy to have self-control. Furthermore, nearly every social event in the US is tied to the consumption of food and cheap unhealthy food can be found almost anywhere.

Re: Ultra-processed foods and the corporate capture of nutrition

#117

Post by jeffreyrogers »

ev1 wrote: post #87
jasode wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>, but in my experience most people prefer these foods because they think it's more convenient. [...] Everyone should learn how to cook some boring, staple meals using basic ingredients from the store. It's amazing how many people don't know how easy and cheap it can be to prepare simple crock pot or stir-fry meals that are healthy and delicious. I'm a strict health food eater but I have to be realistic and concede t…

Disappointingly, some people quite literally cannot cook - I don't have a stove. This is a lot more common[0] than one might think, and arguably hits the worst demographic for it - university students and fresh out of university students, where the only affordable place is $2-3k for barely a hundred square feet with a microwave and minifridge. There is a fair amount of places near tech companies where it's quite comm…

Get an airfryer and an instant pot. Neither one takes up much space on a countertop, and they are easy to clean and store. I hardly use my stove anymore unless I'm baking something.

Re: Ultra-processed foods and the corporate capture of nutrition

#118

Post by selimthegrim »

jriot wrote: post #79
jasode wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>, but in my experience most people prefer these foods because they think it's more convenient. [...] Everyone should learn how to cook some boring, staple meals using basic ingredients from the store. It's amazing how many people don't know how easy and cheap it can be to prepare simple crock pot or stir-fry meals that are healthy and delicious. I'm a strict health food eater but I have to be realistic and concede t…

Cooking in general is time consuming. You and I appear to eat vastly differently, yet we both make our own food from scratch. For breakfast I eat 10oz whole milk, 2 - 3 strips of bacon, 2 - 3 eggs, and grits with butter (at time I'll have potatoes or toast depending). Our other other meals will include roasted vegetables, potatoes and meat. Preparing each meal everyday is time consuming but I view as the best investm…

Are you a Randazzo’s devotee? Also curious about data science prospects in the area or remote, tbh

Re: Ultra-processed foods and the corporate capture of nutrition

#119

Post by inglor_cz »

acuozzo wrote: post #116
inglor_cz wrote: post #104

Just by comparing photos and videos from the 1980s to the situation in the streets now, it is painfully obvious that we (and by "we" I mean at least half of humanity) have a serious obesity and metabolic syndrome problem. It is breathtaking how civilized nations silently accept such an enormous slide in quality of life, when other, much smaller problems lead to civic unrest, political discussions and overhaul of old…

(Please forgive the scattered reply. I'm tired and I've mostly pieced this together from other discussions I've had on this topic.) I firmly believe that the problem stems from a mass unspoken refusal to address obesity as a symptom of food addiction. Food addiction is among the hardest to kick because humans not only need food to survive, but also need glucose (and/or ketone bodies) in order to have sufficient menta…

I am just watching the British "Supersize Vs Superskinny" series.

The heavy articipants have serious addiction problem, obviously. The question is whether some foods are inherently addictive, at least for some people who are more predisposed to food addiction.

There are some obvious commonalities in the diets of the superfatties: pretty much every one of them consumes a lot of pizza, fries, soft drinks and various fat-and-salty snacks. "Normal" cooked meals that were the staple of nutrition before the advent of fast food are almost absent from their diets.

Re: Ultra-processed foods and the corporate capture of nutrition

#120

Post by inglor_cz »

jasode wrote: post #50
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #12

This statistic from the article is mind-boggling: > Ultra-processed products now account for nearly half of the average dietary intake of some high income countries, with consumption rising rapidly in most other countries. Note that they aren't just referring to processed foods. They classify ultra-processed foods as a step beyond what we typically think of as processed foods: > Ultra-processed foods and beverages ca…

>, but in my experience most people prefer these foods because they think it's more convenient. [...] Everyone should learn how to cook some boring, staple meals using basic ingredients from the store. It's amazing how many people don't know how easy and cheap it can be to prepare simple crock pot or stir-fry meals that are healthy and delicious. I'm a strict health food eater but I have to be realistic and concede t…

I wonder what is the effect of the widespread loneliness on the willingness and ability to cook.

If you are two or a family, cooking for the others to enjoy is a pleasure. If someone lives alone, I can see why they rather eat something quick-and-dirty.

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