Expanding Fuchsia's open source model • Hacker News Board

Re: Expanding Fuchsia's open source model

#331

Post by zepto » Fri, Dec 11, 2020, 3:07 PM UTC

lern_too_spel wrote: post #328

zepto wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No. I assumed it was because they had already announced it. You said it was already usable after I said that the link you posted showed that it was incomplete. I.e: You made a claim that you didn’t know was true, but stated it as fact, even when you were asked to confirm it. This is known as lying - saying something is true, when you don’t know it is true. In this case I didn’t even call you on it - I just asked wh…

Says the guy who has been caught lying many times after he finally found a single time that I lied. Sure, buddy.

> Says the guy who has been caught lying many times

If this were true, you’d be able to link to an example of me intentionally stating a falsehood.

> after he finally found a single time that I lied

This is the single time you have confessed to lying.

Re: Expanding Fuchsia's open source model

#332

Post by quadrangle » Sat, Dec 12, 2020, 6:07 PM UTC

tesmar2 wrote: post #329

quadrangle wrote: post #327

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use DuckDuckGo myself. The issue isn't that no alternatives exist (if that were the case, it would be much clearer that Google had a plain and simple monopoly). The issue is that Google can unilaterally kill or make other businesses through their search. For example, they can use their search dominance to push everyone into Chrome in order to kill Firefox (even as they pay Mozilla and Apple to keep Google as defaul…

> The issue is that Google can unilaterally kill or make other businesses through their search. I don't see how this answers my statement. Of course they can, it's their platform. I'm sure MS pushes their new browser on bing. There's another thread open today where people have listed a ton of alternates so one can de-google. I did it 2 years ago, it's been fine. Apple Maps is much better than it used to be, bing is b…

I'm not saying it's a clear conclusion that Google has a monopoly that must be regulated/broken-up. I'm saying that it's not conclusive. The case is strong enough to seriously consider and to evaluate. I think the duopoly of iOS/Android is probably the most serious issue, even more than search. But none of this is simple cut-and-dry.

Re: Expanding Fuchsia's open source model

#333

Post by jasonvorhe » Tue, Dec 15, 2020, 12:36 PM UTC

phh wrote: post #156

jasonvorhe wrote: post #123

I don't understand the cynicism here. Android's fragmentation was the original sin that lead to fragmentation and the new that we've seen for years, until Google semi-fixed the mess with a) Play Services (short term) and b) Project Treble. Google were so convinced of the value of open source that they didn't anticipate that almost all OEM's would rather ship their Android forks than to stay close to upstream. If they…

Project Treble didn't fix anything (I'm very happy with Project Treble, because it lets me hack stuff I couldn't begin to imagine with 4 yrs ago, but that's just hack). It didn't even fix Nexus/Pixels that still have the same upgrade track record as a Samsung 100$ device. (Pixel 1 and Pixel 2 users, feel free to come and use my Generic System Image, I'll keep upgrading you as long as I can with my bare hands!) ATM OE…

Thank you for sharing your experience and for the lengthy reply, it was really enlightening!

Re: Expanding Fuchsia's open source model

#334

Post by tesmar2 » Tue, Dec 15, 2020, 5:07 PM UTC

quadrangle wrote: post #332

tesmar2 wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The issue is that Google can unilaterally kill or make other businesses through their search. I don't see how this answers my statement. Of course they can, it's their platform. I'm sure MS pushes their new browser on bing. There's another thread open today where people have listed a ton of alternates so one can de-google. I did it 2 years ago, it's been fine. Apple Maps is much better than it used to be, bing is b…

I'm not saying it's a clear conclusion that Google has a monopoly that must be regulated/broken-up. I'm saying that it's not conclusive. The case is strong enough to seriously consider and to evaluate. I think the duopoly of iOS/Android is probably the most serious issue, even more than search. But none of this is simple cut-and-dry.

So for search they are not a monopoly, not even close.

For iOS/Android, I'm not seeing a problem just because they are popular. Is there some specific legislation you would like passed which would interfere and most likely overreach into their companies?

Like you said, it's not cut and dry because there isn't a monopoly. If an upstart company came along and wanted to make a new mobileOS, I wish them well. If Google or Apple did something wrong to interfere with their success, bring a suit at that time with specific claims.