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Earnestness

paulgraham.com

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Re: Earnestness

#31

Post by ajju »

croissants wrote: post #10

My perception is that one drawback of earnestness is that it often comes off as just being boring. The most earnest people I know are not popular. The most popular people I know are more like twinkle-in-the-eye-kind-of-BS-but-not-pathological-liars. I don't mean to say "grr, why aren't nerds more popular!". I mean more that this specific kind of earnestness seems to preclude the playing of certain conversational game…

As someone who is most likely on the more boring end of the spectrum, I agree with many parts of your comment :)

Still, I have learned that being earnest and being fun are not opposites. Sometimes earnest people are spending most of their time focused on work (and if they are good natured, its fun to work with them!). But one can get better at being fun if you value and prioritize having fun with other people for its own sake.

I have also found that folks (including me) particularly enjoy friends who are earnest about their work / side projects. I especially enjoy spending time with friends who are earnestly interested in areas I know little about. Their energy and enthusiasm are infectious and talking to them about their area opens these clear windows into new worlds that are otherwise hard to find.

Re: Earnestness

#34

Post by throwaway2245 »

darkerside wrote: post #27

> Interestingly, just as the word "nerd" implies earnestness even when used as a metaphor, the word "politics" implies the opposite. It's not only in actual politics that earnestness seems to be a handicap, but also in office politics and academic politics. I don't think this is always the case. I've found that no matter the size of the business, they are made up of people, and people have bullshit detectors. When yo…

In politics, the word "technocrat" is used to try to carve out a divide between specific intellectual talent and political leadership talent, with a heavy implication that these are mutually exclusive.

I think that's how PG is using "earnest" here. He presents it first as a compliment but goes on to suggest that it is exclusive from understanding other people's motivations, and by extension, exclusive from business leadership.

I take it as an underhanded compliment.

Re: Earnestness

#35

Post by warent »

boxed wrote: post #6
Quarrelsome wrote: post #2

Earnest is my favourite word for describing that beautiful part during a child's development where they haven't yet had a negative experience from expressing themselves earnestly. That window of time where if you ask if they know something they would proudly reply "no!" because they have no idea that there might be shame in not knowing something. I seek to try to make myself more earnest and undo the damage of fear o…

Once in my 20s I hung out with some young teenagers at a summer camp for reasons . One night we were talking and one girl started asking questions and the rest of the group sneered at her "not knowing". She ignored them and kept asking because I was earnest and knowledgeable. Five minutes turned to an hour and I think everyone in that group learned (or at least heard) more about the origins of the universe, stellar e…

The sentence you opened this up with comes across kind of concerning and gross. For reasons?

Re: Earnestness

#37

Post by voidhorse »

throwaway2245 wrote: post #34
darkerside wrote: post #27

> Interestingly, just as the word "nerd" implies earnestness even when used as a metaphor, the word "politics" implies the opposite. It's not only in actual politics that earnestness seems to be a handicap, but also in office politics and academic politics. I don't think this is always the case. I've found that no matter the size of the business, they are made up of people, and people have bullshit detectors. When yo…

In politics, the word "technocrat" is used to try to carve out a divide between specific intellectual talent and political leadership talent, with a heavy implication that these are mutually exclusive. I think that's how PG is using "earnest" here. He presents it first as a compliment but goes on to suggest that it is exclusive from understanding other people's motivations, and by extension, exclusive from business l…

And on the other side, “politics” is anathema to “nerds” and technocrats because good technocrats typically have a nice mix of the old school sociopathic qualities required to succeed in business along with technical chops. They don’t like politics because they typically lack emotional intelligence, don’t comprehend the need for empathy, and think their experience is the only experience that matters. They likewise usually have a regressive ultra-utilitarian philosophy.

This doesn’t apply to everyone or any actual human beings of course, but since we’re talking about abstract made up nonsense character types, might as well go along with it.

Re: Earnestness

#38

Post by Dumblydorr »

I earnestly think his writing has an overindulgent fandom here. Every single blog post rockets to the top and, in my opinion, they are usually short and lacking in citation, evidence, or persuasion. He may write snappily, but is every single post worthy of Han's top slot?

Re: Earnestness

#39

Post by dragonwriter »

throwaway2245 wrote: post #34
darkerside wrote: post #27

> Interestingly, just as the word "nerd" implies earnestness even when used as a metaphor, the word "politics" implies the opposite. It's not only in actual politics that earnestness seems to be a handicap, but also in office politics and academic politics. I don't think this is always the case. I've found that no matter the size of the business, they are made up of people, and people have bullshit detectors. When yo…

In politics, the word "technocrat" is used to try to carve out a divide between specific intellectual talent and political leadership talent, with a heavy implication that these are mutually exclusive. I think that's how PG is using "earnest" here. He presents it first as a compliment but goes on to suggest that it is exclusive from understanding other people's motivations, and by extension, exclusive from business l…

> In politics, the word "technocrat" is used to try to carve out a divide between specific intellectual talent and political leadership talent, implication being that these are exclusive.

No, in politics, “technocrat” describes an advocate of rule by an elite of technical experts. When applied to a candidate for office, it often more specifically designates someone who sees their own self-evaluated membership in such an elite as their primary qualification for office. It does not designate actual talent, nor does it imply anything about the separation between different types of talent.

Re: Earnestness

#40

Post by ignoramous »

Quarrelsome wrote: post #2

Earnest is my favourite word for describing that beautiful part during a child's development where they haven't yet had a negative experience from expressing themselves earnestly. That window of time where if you ask if they know something they would proudly reply "no!" because they have no idea that there might be shame in not knowing something. I seek to try to make myself more earnest and undo the damage of fear o…

> I seek to try to make myself more earnest and undo the damage of fear of retribution/shame but I'm always a bit sad when I get in trouble because I was straight forward but adult politics is sadly complex sometimes.

You might enjoy reading these two posts and discussions:

"The power of ignorance" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23041281

"Asking questions" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22729028

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