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The M1 MacBook Air: Perfection

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Re: The M1 MacBook Air: Perfection

#41

Post by coldtea »

mhh__ wrote: post #34
dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.techradar.com/news/you-can-now-run-linux-and-win...

"Near native performance" i.e. not native

Yeah, so?

Native performance doesn't mean anything aside from the same program/OS running on the same system. In other words, "native performance" is the baseline for a relative speed comparison, not some absolute value that makes sense in itself.

Thus, "Near native" on the M1 could be faster than native on an Intel machine. Or on an ARM, for that matter: https://www.macworld.co.uk/news/apple-m1-runs-windows-faster....

Re: The M1 MacBook Air: Perfection

#42

Post by coldtea »

phren0logy wrote: post #4

With the ability to run iOS apps, the lack of a touch screen leaves me scratching my head. The only reason I have resisted buying one is that the lack of a touch screen is, in my view, going to make it feel like I missed the boat once that's inevitably added.

Have you ever used a laptop with a touch screen for any reasonable time?

Did you really use the touch for more than a few minutes as a novelty?

I'm not talking of laptops with detachable screens here (there it does make sense).

Re: The M1 MacBook Air: Perfection

#43

Post by coldtea »

Deinos wrote: post #28
phren0logy wrote: post #4

With the ability to run iOS apps, the lack of a touch screen leaves me scratching my head. The only reason I have resisted buying one is that the lack of a touch screen is, in my view, going to make it feel like I missed the boat once that's inevitably added.

It just feels like stubbornness to me at this point. I don't think there would be enough overlap that adding touch to the mac would reduce tablet sales... totally different experiences in a lot of ways. I've had touch on my last 2 Thinkpads and find that I utilize it quite a bit. I haven't noticed a ton of fingerprints, but I also take care of my equipment (probably a little more fastidiously than most...). Having th…

>It just feels like stubbornness to me at this point. I don't think there would be enough overlap that adding touch to the mac would reduce tablet sales... totally different experiences in a lot of ways.

Apple cannibalizes its own products all the time, it's not about reducing tablet sales.

It's probably more about not really making sense (at least, them thinking that), even where it is available (on Windows laptops).

It might be added at some point, but not because its actually useful, but after they have exhausted more useful differentiating factors to add to newer models.

Re: The M1 MacBook Air: Perfection

#44

Post by dillera »

chronolitus wrote: post #36
495636483 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's be entirely honest, also: A perfect "laptop" would be a convertible, or tablet + X. The Air is not missing touch; the iPad is missing a full-access operating system. IMO, there is nothing a laptop has, a tablet couldn't. Just make it a tiny bit thicker, or add a detachable module for extra battery and ports and storage or whatever. Why is it better? Most importantly, the ergonomic constraints of a laptop make i…

Your description sounds close to the Surface Book. I'm suprised Apple hasn't come up with a contender. I guess the market for that kind of device is just not big enough for them?

I have a surfaceBook- I never take off the keyboard. I would never use a touch-screen on a laptop as finger marks on the screen are not optimal for working.

Re: The M1 MacBook Air: Perfection

#45

Post by berberous »

chronolitus wrote: post #36
495636483 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's be entirely honest, also: A perfect "laptop" would be a convertible, or tablet + X. The Air is not missing touch; the iPad is missing a full-access operating system. IMO, there is nothing a laptop has, a tablet couldn't. Just make it a tiny bit thicker, or add a detachable module for extra battery and ports and storage or whatever. Why is it better? Most importantly, the ergonomic constraints of a laptop make i…

Your description sounds close to the Surface Book. I'm suprised Apple hasn't come up with a contender. I guess the market for that kind of device is just not big enough for them?

Well I pay Apple for two devices now, laptop and iPad, rather than just one.

I think at some point they will eventually do it, but why rush it while you’re still raking in money.

I’m suspicious multi-user iPad support is delayed for similar reasons. Many spouses have their own iPad now, when they could probably share if there was multi user support.

Re: The M1 MacBook Air: Perfection

#46

Post by mhh__ »

coldtea wrote: post #41
mhh__ wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Near native performance" i.e. not native

Yeah, so? Native performance doesn't mean anything aside from the same program/OS running on the same system. In other words, "native performance" is the baseline for a relative speed comparison, not some absolute value that makes sense in itself. Thus, "Near native" on the M1 could be faster than native on an Intel machine. Or on an ARM, for that matter: https://www.macworld.co.uk/news/apple-m1-runs-windows-faster..…

Native means you have access to the hardware through the kernel of your choice, it's not about performance.

If there is a hypervisor in between you and your CPU - let alone emulation - you lose direct access to things like performance counters (which I need to be able to do a lot of things I enjoy programming). On top of that you also now have to trust (this isn't even security, the implementation can be buggy) a hypervisor - they effectively have to mimic the behaviour of a CPU, they aren't perfect.

Re: The M1 MacBook Air: Perfection

#47

Post by 495636483 »

chronolitus wrote: post #36
495636483 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's be entirely honest, also: A perfect "laptop" would be a convertible, or tablet + X. The Air is not missing touch; the iPad is missing a full-access operating system. IMO, there is nothing a laptop has, a tablet couldn't. Just make it a tiny bit thicker, or add a detachable module for extra battery and ports and storage or whatever. Why is it better? Most importantly, the ergonomic constraints of a laptop make i…

Your description sounds close to the Surface Book. I'm suprised Apple hasn't come up with a contender. I guess the market for that kind of device is just not big enough for them?

Yes! But the major pain is Windows (and the hardware, isn't as efficient) It's like a worse Apple. I would also immediately go with a thinkpad $X Yoga, if there was a ryzen AND >FHD model.

I think most people looking for a "laptop" just aren't aware, how useful a pen is. They don't think "annotate everything", anymore, even tho they grew up like that. Their mind has grown bend over the laptop.

The device itself isn't all to the appeal, too: The inter app operability is key to get the mind free. iOS does this quite well, superficially. But for me the honey moon phase ended when I realized - well, Stallman was right!

The locked down, and locking-in, overly profit-driven ecosystem just kills it for me.

I believe an ultimate device like that could really revive the Linux desktop, because the device would thrive with a holistic ecosystem, where apps can coexist, don't habe to fight for the user's wallet.

Re: The M1 MacBook Air: Perfection

#48

Post by coldtea »

mhh__ wrote: post #46
coldtea wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, so? Native performance doesn't mean anything aside from the same program/OS running on the same system. In other words, "native performance" is the baseline for a relative speed comparison, not some absolute value that makes sense in itself. Thus, "Near native" on the M1 could be faster than native on an Intel machine. Or on an ARM, for that matter: https://www.macworld.co.uk/news/apple-m1-runs-windows-faster..…

Native means you have access to the hardware through the kernel of your choice, it's not about performance. If there is a hypervisor in between you and your CPU - let alone emulation - you lose direct access to things like performance counters (which I need to be able to do a lot of things I enjoy programming). On top of that you also now have to trust (this isn't even security, the implementation can be buggy) a hyp…

>Native means you have access to the hardware through the kernel of your choice, it's not about performance.

Yeah, I know what "native" means.

I talked about the use of "native performance". That when used for comparison, it doesn't mean anything, unless it compares between the program running on the native OS and virtualized on the same machine.

So, saying

"Near native performance" i.e. not native"

(a) doesn't say anything as a general statement (of course it's less than 100% of native, as its virtualized), and

(b) is moot as an argument against the M1 (since this "non native" performance could still could be e.g. 100% or even 120% of the native performance of another machine, which would make it more than enough).

Re: The M1 MacBook Air: Perfection

#49

Post by 495636483 »

dillera wrote: post #44
chronolitus wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your description sounds close to the Surface Book. I'm suprised Apple hasn't come up with a contender. I guess the market for that kind of device is just not big enough for them?

I have a surfaceBook- I never take off the keyboard. I would never use a touch-screen on a laptop as finger marks on the screen are not optimal for working.

I get that about touch. For me typing and touch/pen input would make two distinct modes. In typing mode, I absolutely want the precision of a mouse/touchpad. Arms need to be rested on the table or similar. Working free-..ehm.. armed, in front of you is a disproven scifi-only concept. Same as transparent displays...

Re: The M1 MacBook Air: Perfection

#50

Post by mjhagen »

phren0logy wrote: post #4

With the ability to run iOS apps, the lack of a touch screen leaves me scratching my head. The only reason I have resisted buying one is that the lack of a touch screen is, in my view, going to make it feel like I missed the boat once that's inevitably added.

Touch targets are way too small, especially if you run your screen at a higher resolution.
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