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French watchdog fines Google, Amazon for breaching cookies rules

fr.reuters.com

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Re: French watchdog fines Google, Amazon for breaching cookies rules

#91

Post by simpss »

dalbasal wrote: post #63

I have mixed feelings. On one hand, the data harvesting targeted by cookie laws and associated privacy stuff is important and legislators/regulators are right to target it. OTOH, effectiveness is pretty marginal. There have been some (minor) gains on disclosure. Somewhat better progress on data selling/sharing/security. But, no real gains on consent, which is a big part of the regulatory effort and this specific case…

it takes a lot of time for regulators to catch up with all the shenanigans the bigger offenders are pulling.

But, it does give internal employees the tools to fix it in smaller companies, or smaller companies that use the services of these global companies(ex, google analytics).

Pre-gdpr, if I raised some of these points in any of my workplaces, nothing ever came out of it. Now, it's a different story.

Same with direct-marketing spam e-mails, where a customer complains.

It'll take some time for regulators to sort out the big offenders, but the regulation is already having a positive effect within smaller companies.

Re: French watchdog fines Google, Amazon for breaching cookies rules

#92

Post by that_guy_iain »

fsflover wrote: post #62
that_guy_iain wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're at the stage now where they can reasonably reliably track you without cookies. I think we need to focus more on restricting what companies can do with data than focusing on asking users permission for things. Popup-hell doesn't help anyone in my opinion.

AFAIK, this is exactly what GDPR is doing.

GDPR works well in this direction but it still adds in the informed consent which caused alot of the popups and the original cookie law was the EU as well. Basically, the EU while making the internet better is also making it worse. But it's a process and I think GDPR is a move in the right direction.

Re: French watchdog fines Google, Amazon for breaching cookies rules

#93

Post by LunaSea »

swiley wrote: post #81
pestaa wrote: post #34

Everybody is so focused on 'cookies' as if the technology itself was regulated. The web developers (or marketing agencies or whatever) are also slow to learn what proper data protection means, and slap popups and banners on everything, making the web disgusting and regulations seem misguided. A session cookie, especially after a login, may not require consent at all. Describe in your policy what personal data, if any…

Session cookies for handling a login make sense. Session cookies on static pages are a violation of people's privacy.

What about a session cookie that is used for more than just authentication like for example tying browsing sessions on different devices by the same user together?

Re: French watchdog fines Google, Amazon for breaching cookies rules

#94

Post by TheCoelacanth »

ape4 wrote: post #76

Do these laws apply to browser local storage and all other ways to save info? And once a user says "no" to cookies/tracking how is that saved, in a cookie?

The technical means that you use to accomplish tracking doesn't matter at all. Even server-side storage is covered.

Storing a cookie that says the the user opted out of tracking is perfectly fine.

GDPR isn't about cookies. It's about tracking of personal information.

Re: French watchdog fines Google, Amazon for breaching cookies rules

#95

Post by TheCoelacanth »

Macha wrote: post #54
scambier wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I do not want to disable all cookies, I'm perfectly happy to use credential cookies or a shopping cart The cookie banner that you have to refuse/accept only concerns cookies that are not necessary for the proper functioning of the site. So login cookies or shopping cart are unaffected by the consent, and if your site has nothing else than this, it does not need to ask for consent.

Many sites, upon clicking reject, do not actually disable anything and simply suggest you disable cookies in your browser (sometimes with instructions).

Which is probably not legal.

Re: French watchdog fines Google, Amazon for breaching cookies rules

#96

Post by simpss »

that_guy_iain wrote: post #21
gpderetta wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did set DNT but I'm still getting tracked. I do not want to disable all cookies, I'm perfectly happy to use credential cookies or a shopping cart, I do not want to disable everything indiscriminately. Also I shouldn't have to out out.

We're at the stage now where they can reasonably reliably track you without cookies. I think we need to focus more on restricting what companies can do with data than focusing on asking users permission for things. Popup-hell doesn't help anyone in my opinion.

GDPR deals with identifiers that can tie data to a single individual. Cookie IDs are just one way of doing that, true.

That's why GDPR is so powerful and a well thought out regulation. Replace the technology completely, but GDPR still applies as user-unique identifiers are still used. ex, cookie with fingerprint.js, nothing really changes. You still need to ask for consent for user-level tracking.

Re: French watchdog fines Google, Amazon for breaching cookies rules

#97

Post by iamacyborg »

dalbasal wrote: post #63

I have mixed feelings. On one hand, the data harvesting targeted by cookie laws and associated privacy stuff is important and legislators/regulators are right to target it. OTOH, effectiveness is pretty marginal. There have been some (minor) gains on disclosure. Somewhat better progress on data selling/sharing/security. But, no real gains on consent, which is a big part of the regulatory effort and this specific case…

> OTOH, effectiveness is pretty marginal. There have been some (minor) gains on disclosure. Somewhat better progress on data selling/sharing/security. But, no real gains on consent, which is a big part of the regulatory effort and this specific case.

From experience, a lot of folks were waiting to see what Google/Amazon/FB/etc were doing and using them as examples of what to do. These fines should help apply some downward pressure now that the regulator has explicitly called out this illegal behaviour.

Re: French watchdog fines Google, Amazon for breaching cookies rules

#98

Post by LunaSea »

aenario wrote: post #79
y04nn wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DNT is too simple, there should be new better standard integrated in web browsers. The never ending popups with absolutely 0 constancy across sites is atrocious, moreover if I rejected a cookie for a domain on site A I will be prompted on site B if I want to reject it again. For every domain that wants to create cookies, I should be prompted by the browser (like I allow camera access) if I authorize it to do so, we c…

Ultimately the only cookie an users will willingly accept is the sessionid/rememberme. And the "remember me" checkbox is consent enough under the GDPR. Behing all the legalese and marketing-speach, all the other purposes boils down to : - We are too lazy to setup a matomo, so we are giving google your browsing pattern. - FB is forcing us, so we can pay ever so slightly less for ads - Google is offering to tell us you…

I asked this elsewhere in the thread as well, but what about tracking done through the session cookie?

e.g: Tying together two browsing sessions by one user on two different devices.

Re: French watchdog fines Google, Amazon for breaching cookies rules

#99

Post by dsnr »

avianlyric wrote: post #50
dsnr wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, I feel this is just a new source of income for governments. They seem to be too keen on handing out fines in those areas where it‘s simple to do so, but fail to act in other areas where the consumer is constantly being hurt e.g. right to repair, warranty laws, right to return digital products.

> fail to act in other areas where the consumer is constantly being hurt e.g. right to repair, warranty laws, right to return digital products. This is the EU we’re talking about. It’s a bit weak on right to repair at the moment. But on warranties and digital product returns, we have some pretty strong and effective protections.

That’s not true, you don’t have the right to return digital products at the moment (discs, software, video games etc). For warranties, there are a lot of problems consumers face that don’t get talked about, but I won’t get into detail here.
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