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FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization

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Re: FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization

#301
post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Amazon promoting its own brands isn't much different from a supermarket offering its own brand items. The huge difference here is that when you go into Walmart you don't announce to the company what you want to buy.

Is it really that big of a difference? You still have to go to the one section of walmart where they stock the cheese or car batteries or whatever. Walmart can set up their own shelves to emphasize their own brands if they want. If you pay with a credit card at walmart they can collect the same data about your purchase history as amazon would as well.

Walmart paid for the products on their shelves. Amazon does not pay for most of the products you can buy on Amazon.

The difference, in case it's not clear: Walmart is the manufacturers' primary customer, so it's irrelevant from their point of view what products Walmart chooses to sell in its stores.

The third-party sellers are the manufacturer's customers. The manufacturers still get paid either way. But we're not concerned about the manufacturers; the antitrust issue is with the third party sellers. Since Amazon uses their data to come up with competing products that are sold in the same marketplace, it matters a great deal that Amazon competes with them, and how.

Re: FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization

#302
post #273
post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's no way to provide access to the social graph in a privacy preserving way. If we're not okay with other companies having access then why is it okay for a single company to have that access? Do you know and trust every facebook employee including those that don't work there yet with your data? Do you trust that that data will be securely handled when the company is sold after declaring bankruptcy? I think you…

I think the accidental straw-man is actually your reply. People give Facebook their access willingly and they know what information they input into Facebook. Should Facebook have all the info your bank has for instance? Or auto mechanic, your realtor? This is a slippery slope of logic of shared data for all leads to.

I'm sure Facebook buys all the data on you that it can, which in America is an amazing amount of information. Your auto mechanic is likely already selling what is being done to your car to CarFax, etc.

Re: FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization

#304
post #35

Monopoly of what? Some other social networks I use every day or so: Twitter, LinkedIn, TikTok and various forums and communities like this one, which in my mind are pretty similar to a social network. And since WhatsApp is a chat app, how about all the other chat apps I am using? iMessage, Slack, Teams. Does this action has any merit or is it just the usual political posturing and games?

You might read up on the Trusts era that brought about the Sherman Act[1]. Trains? Horse carriages and wagons were still available, not to mention boats. However, these are not equal modes of travel, though they are "similar" in that they are transportation , and so it's not about internet-based communities per se. It's the fact that Facebook is "Facebook" that is the problem. That you can't imagine Facebook's equal…

By this definition it seems like every social media app, by virtue of it being different, is a monopoly of its own? Eg: Twitter is “Twitter” that is the problem.

Re: FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization

#305

Not a lawyer, but I'm really curious to see how this plays out. This case has a lot of confounding factors: * other companies/entities that can be considered "competitors" (Twitter, TikTok, LinkedIn, etc) * the acquisitions in question (Instagram and WhatsApp) being approved by the suing entity (namely, the FTC) themselves back in the day I wouldn't be surprised if an outcome of this were to be say, limits against cr…

I'm also not a lawyer, but this sounds unconstitutional. This lawsuit sounds even more extreme than ex post facto laws, since antitrust laws haven't changed.

My pet theory is that the legislature is so divided and incompetent that laws are horribly outdated. The other two branches of government need to compensate. Google v. Oracle is another example of this.

Re: FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization

#306
post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the FTC.gov[1]: "The antitrust laws prohibit conduct by a single firm that unreasonably restrains competition by creating or maintaining monopoly power. Most Section 2 claims involve the conduct of a firm with a leading market position, although Section 2 of the Sherman Act also bans attempts to monopolize and conspiracies to monopolize. As a first step, courts ask if the firm has "monopoly power" in any market.…

The lawsuit is about Facebook’s acquisition of WhatsApp and Instagram effectively roping in users from other platforms into their advertising ecosystem. The monetisation of your data in exchange for adverts can be seen as the cost of the platforms. By aggressively increasing advertising on Instagram and attempting to take steps to monetize WhatsApp, Facebook are raising prices. As far as I understand the question is…

The FTC cleared FB to buy Instagram in the first place[1]. Any idea what changed?

[1] https://www.reuters.com/article/us-facebook-instagram-idUSBR...

Re: FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization

#307
post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Line, Viber, Telegram, Signal, Matrix etc etc.....there is so much competition in the messaging space.

WhatsApp is basically the norm outside of the US from what I can tell? So yeah, there's really no "competition". Either you have whatsapp or you don't talk to people. And it's highly used for cross-business communication in Europe, I can tell you that.

Splitting WA from Facebook isn’t going to change that though. It’s still going to look like WA is a monopoly, then what?

Re: FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization

#308

When Facebook first went public, an older relative asked me if he should invest in Facebook. My only insight was being an internet user at the time and I said no, there was no reason that Facebook wouldn’t be another MySpace. Facebook's only value was their users and users were historically very finicky and moved around platforms at will. I argued that Facebook would make no money and wouldn’t be around in a couple o…

Wrong? No, just early. Yahoo and AOL were really big and growing... until they weren't.

Given enough time, you can say that about any company.

Re: FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization

#309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if I don't want you telling folks that you are my friend? Why do you get to divulge this information to a third party that I know nothing about?

Can you stop your real-world friends from divulging your friendship to 3rd parties? Would you even presume to have any standing to do so? I think a case could be made that knowledge that belongs to A and B equally and that neither has standing to preclude the other from sharing that fact. Of course they could both mutually agree to such an arrangement ahead of time, but outside of such an agreement, I have a hard tim…

Like that Seinfeld episode where George _happily_ gives Jerry's address to the dog owner...

Re: FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization

#310
post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Known backdoors? Can you back that up with a source? Custom implementation is likely because they want to strike a balance between security and usability.

https://thehackernews.com/2017/01/whatsapp-encryption-backdo... In short, their implementation allows to change the encryption keys of users without their consent to arbitrary, known keys. The protocol won't re-encrypt sent messages, but there is nothing in the protocol forcing the app to show a notification that your encryption key has changed, which amounts to a man-in-the-middle attack. Any subsequent messages sen…

Wasn't this specific story debunked? (Don't shoot me, I'm genuinely asking)
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