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CentOS Project shifts focus to CentOS Stream

lists.centos.org

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Re: CentOS Project shifts focus to CentOS Stream

#591

Post by unionpivo »

m463 wrote: post #554
happyjack wrote: post #51

Wow. I kind of new this day was coming. I work in engineering / science (not comp. sci or developing) and all our software vendors are Windows or RHEL support only. Although if you know your way around linux any flavor will do, but RHEL is the "standard" for support. It's kind of like "insurance." We expect this to compile / work for RHEL and NOTHING else, because RHEL is stable, predictable, and boring. I've run mos…

Ubuntu phones home a lot. Don't know if that applies to rhel

not the server.

my biggest complaint about ubuntu server is that docker is packaged as a snap. But that takes 30s to fix (includding googling for a fix :) )

Re: CentOS Project shifts focus to CentOS Stream

#592

Post by montjoy »

Jimmc414 wrote: post #266
awill wrote: post #109

This is awful. It's proof of the downsides to the IBM acquisition, which I think we all knew was coming. Imagine if you were running a business, and deployed CentOS 8 based on the 10 year lifespan promise. You're totally screwed now, and Red Hat knows it. Why on earth didn't they make this switch starting with CentOS 9???? Let's not sugar coat this. They've betrayed their users. I personally run a CentOS 7 server (as…

>> Imagine if you were running a business, and deployed CentOS 8 based on the 10 year lifespan promise. You're totally screwed now, and Red Hat knows it. The hypothetical you posed is the actual situation, I am now learning, I have apparently forced on my team. We've ramped up labor 3x revenue preparing product launch in 90 - 180 days. We created an image containing centos 8 , Java , postgres and tomcat a year ago an…

I’d recommend using Oracle Linux 8 if you still need 1 to 1 compatibility. At my company I’m recommending Amazon Linux 2.

Re: CentOS Project shifts focus to CentOS Stream

#594

Post by [deleted] »

kseifried wrote: post #503
Jimmc414 wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Imagine if you were running a business, and deployed CentOS 8 based on the 10 year lifespan promise. You're totally screwed now, and Red Hat knows it. The hypothetical you posed is the actual situation, I am now learning, I have apparently forced on my team. We've ramped up labor 3x revenue preparing product launch in 90 - 180 days. We created an image containing centos 8 , Java , postgres and tomcat a year ago an…

What I don't get is this: You build software, you ship it on an OS so it works, cool, this makes sense (I assume you need hardware and VM support, not just VM). Why would you accept additional risk on the OS if you can easily reduce the risk, and ultimate cost, by going with an OS that has vendor support written into the actual contract? RHEL is 11-13 years total, Windows is... I'm guessing my grandkids will be using…

[deleted]

Re: CentOS Project shifts focus to CentOS Stream

#596

Post by nix23 »

soraminazuki wrote: post #529
norswap wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm wondering, what ties you so strongly to a single OS? Nay, to a single Linux distribution? I have a hard time imagining, and the only scenarios that come to mind are those where things have gone awfully haywire. I'm sure I'm missing something. Enlighten me?

Software doesn’t run on its own. They rely on bunch of other software that is typically provided by distributions. So unless there’s some magic piece of technology that can take CentOS RPMs and make it work flawlessly on any Linux distro, the entire software industry is suddenly going to have to spend significant amounts of time on repackaging work.

>Java , postgres and tomcat

That's his stack...

>So unless there’s some magic piece of technology that can take CentOS RPMs and make it work flawlessly on any Linux distro,

It's not magic, just alien.

Re: CentOS Project shifts focus to CentOS Stream

#597

Post by nix23 »

arbitrage wrote: post #394
kbenson wrote: post #354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That in no way explains why they don't continue to have both. They indeed will have both for another year. There was no requirement the Stream product even use the CentOS name. CentOS was a community project whose leadership and control was taken over (acqui-hired as you say) by Red Hat and then it's core use case for the majority of people actually using it was discontinued. That is a statement of facts that happene…

> That in no way explains why they don't continue to have both. They're a business ... are you honestly and in good-faith actually confused about this outcome?

Yes i am, redhat had a really good ride being the trustfully and good guy.

Re: CentOS Project shifts focus to CentOS Stream

#599

Post by pjmlp »

bayindirh wrote: post #587
pjmlp wrote: post #577

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What we need are top level JIT, AOT and GC implementations, anything else is just going backwards. The people capable of achieving that, naturally have bills to pay.

> What we need are top level JIT, AOT and GC implementations, anything else is just going backwards. Not always. As I aforementioned in another thread, we also need C/C++, Python, Perl, etc. as is since they fill different roles and attack different problems. I've written Java, C, C++, Python, Perl, PHP. Had to abuse some of them to fit roles which they're not designed to do. At the end of the day, these languages sa…

C and C++ development is sponsored by the corporations of Apple, Microsoft, IBM, Oracle, Google....

PHP was mostly driven by Facebook needs.

None of them is any different from Oracle.

And apparently you fail to understand who has contributed to state of the art implemetnations of AOT compilation to toolchains like LLVM, hint the companies that HN loves to hate, it weren't weekend and late night coders.

Re: CentOS Project shifts focus to CentOS Stream

#600

Post by pjmlp »

bayindirh wrote: post #586
pjmlp wrote: post #576

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope, IBM, Azul, Amazon, Red-Hat, Alibaba, Twitter, Microsoft also seat at the Java table. Should I also start listing the dark sides of each company that seats at ISO C and ISO C++ table? Python working groups also need money from those corporations, and Python is yet to provide the performance levels of Java, so much for free beer development.

> Nope, IBM, Azul, Amazon, Red-Hat, Alibaba, Twitter, Microsoft also seat at the Java table. I know Java has stakeholders but, what I'm trying to say is the table is at Oracle's HQ, not somewhere else. > Should I also start listing the dark sides of each company that seats at ISO C and ISO C++ table? A primer would be nice, actually. > Python working groups also need money from those corporations, and Python is yet t…

> A primer would be nice, actually.

Microsoft, the evil company over here, that keeps being compared to Oracle. Several C++20 features like Modules and co-routines were driven by their VC++ implementations.

Apple, the company hated over here by bringing the end of open platforms, without it LLVM and clang wouldn't ever exist.

Google, the spying company and forking Linux with Android, the second major clang and llvm contributor.

IBM and Red-Hat, with their own Linux agenda pushing stuff like systemd hated over here, major GCC contributors.

You are missing the whole point with Java, it isn't about Java, rather all mainstream languages just like Java only move forward with dirty money (from HN point of view), but hey it is cool to hate Oracle.

Hint they are one of the first enterprise contributors to the Linux kernel and have been ever since.

Do you also feel like removing Oracle contributions from the Linux kernel?

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