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Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

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Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#241

Post by TuringNYC »

stryan wrote: post #230
TuringNYC wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Yeah, I've had some friends leave (to CO and DC), but I'm skeptical of companies and VCs leaving. >> I have had older friends leave to have a family. They went to Santa Cruz, Seattle, Denver, DC, and Austin. It's a shame. The ones that stayed either are very rich where a $5M house is not an issue, or they still live with three roommates and rent without kids. Just wait until they look for interesting jobs and get…

Your experience may be your own; I live just outside of DC as well (though on the MD side) and get bombarded with DC and MD job offers all the time. Perhaps not to the same extent as CA, but saying only 1 or 2 seems like a personal situation.

One more thing for outsiders: Security Clearances are huge here, which really changes outcomes.

@stryan Would love to chat offline if you're open? Really struggling in deciding whether I can continue to live in the region long term, despite being in love with the area and the people.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#242

Post by ericmay »

throwaway45349 wrote: post #237
ericmay wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A few thoughts: 1. Americans need to buy and hold equities. Period. When Google cuts costs or makes more money, I benefit as a shareholder (or you can hold total market indexes and the like). 2. Maybe the money will go to new hires, capabilities, expenditures, etc. ? 3. Sure, but this is certainly a good arguing point against immigration, population growth and H1-B visa programs and the like. 4. Increase taxes on the…

> Increase taxes on the wealthy, etc. Anyone working for a Silicon Valley company as an engineer is almost certainly considered "the wealthy" by most of America.

Yep.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#243

Post by [deleted] »

bradlys wrote: post #102
godot wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did this and completely agree. I lived in the bay area since high school, more than two decades ago. Last year I finally moved away from it for good. Not far, just to the Greater Sacramento area. (I've been working remotely for a couple years, well before COVID) Qualify of life improvement is huge. Weather and cultural are important reasons for me to stay in California (plus family and friends), and I still get tha…

> real summers/not chilly I mean, it's not cold once you get outside of SF/San Bruno. If you're in the peninsula or south bay, it's really fucking hot during the summer. Uncomfortably hot because no one has AC and many of the homes don't have insulation still.

[deleted]

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#244

Post by omgwtfbyobbq »

xyzzy_plugh wrote: post #174
munaf wrote: post #40

It's notable that a lot of people are moving, but I'd wait until at least early 2022 to make judgements about lasting impacts on SV. WFH might not stick widely, and some firms will pick a hybrid model (i.e. partial WFH) over going fully remote. Not to mention that few places can match all the benefits of SV, i.e. unenforceable non-competes, fantastic weather and surroundings, an educated and diverse population, cultu…

I lived in SV for a decade and worked in SF for most of that. > WFH might not stick widely If the vast majority of workers demand it, then I don't think employers will have a choice here. Leaving now is a vote with your feet. > unenforceable non-competes Very few of my peers have ever cared about this in practice. I don't think this is remotely a major benefit compared to e.g. state taxes. > fantastic weather and sur…

I actually cannot think of anything unique to the Bay here...

https://kofytv.com/dance-party/

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#245

Post by AndrewKemendo »

kilbuz wrote: post #162
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Northern Virginia about an Hour from DC. The only two things you miss in VA on your list is "grittiness" which is a negative for me, and walkability, which you could get if you go closer to DC.

And the family, which is maybe the biggest draw for many of us. The more I think about it, the more I realize the choice of where you live is barely rational, if at all. Sure we come up with reason about why we are where we are post hoc, but are those the real reasons? I can almost guarantee I will never move to DC or Virginia. Not because it isn't an amazing place with everything you can want, but because it's just…

Yeah I think that nails it - in the sense that we both are right.

SF/Bay Area is "Good enough" for your needs and VA is "Good enough" for mine and it's not some optimized process, moreso an artifact of our relative histories.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#246

Post by whimsicalism »

mdgrech23 wrote: post #182
xyzzy_plugh wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I lived in SV for a decade and worked in SF for most of that. > WFH might not stick widely If the vast majority of workers demand it, then I don't think employers will have a choice here. Leaving now is a vote with your feet. > unenforceable non-competes Very few of my peers have ever cared about this in practice. I don't think this is remotely a major benefit compared to e.g. state taxes. > fantastic weather and sur…

Employers really don't care what the workers want or think. I can't see employees having the leverage to make much of a dent here.

I mean, employers respond to labor market pressure just like employees do.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#247

Post by Cd00d »

cjhveal wrote: post #173
Cd00d wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I thought it was somewhat due to Stanford's handling of IP. The argument I heard was that if you're researching at Stanford and make a productizable discovery you can spin off a company no strings. I was at Cornell when I heard this, where any company built off on-campus research had to sign over 20% of the company up front. Makes those initial pitches to VC that much harder.

I don't think that's the case. I've anecdotally heard that Stanford does take some (possibly small) amount of equity. From the first paragraph of Stanford's patent policy[0]: > All potentially patentable inventions conceived or first reduced to practice in whole or in part by members of the faculty or staff (including student employees) of the University in the course of their University responsibilities or with more…

That's interesting. Maybe it's the amount of equity that matters so much - it's been years since I heard this and it was an off-hand comment in a talk.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#248

Post by trentnix »

nph5667 wrote: post #220
sandworm101 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> and still come out ahead financially. Ya. Earning a SF wage but living elsewhere is great. But there is a flip side to this coin. As employees realize they can work from home, employers also realize they can have employees work from home. They will soon realize they don't need to pay SF wages. Those who convert their in-office jobs into work-from-home are a covid oddity. Those who will be hired in the future on th…

You are spot on and I am surprised that this is often overlooked. The industry is either on the the track to the massive shift how it operates, or, after COVID it comes back to the traditional in office MO.

I'm not sure it's relevant. It's not as if remote options haven't been available for a long time. The wages in San Francisco aren't determined explicitly by cost-of-living, they are determined by the scarcity of availability of the right resources.

Businesses found it necessary to exist in Silicon Valley because it provided certain benefits, and businesses found it necessary to have on-premises employees because it provided certain benefits. Since California won't allow any on-premises anything, the cost-benefit of being in the Valley and having people in the office is being reset. But if your skills and aptitude are scarce, there's no reason to believe wages won't continue to reflect that. And if your skills and aptitude aren't scarce, you were overpaid in the first place.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#249

Post by burntoutfire »

fumar wrote: post #22
briga wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think California has created this myth that constant sunshine = perfect weather. I personally like things like summer thunderstorms, snowy winters, mild cloudy days, and rain. It's definitely not bad weather, but the lack of variety and endless dry smoggy summer months can get pretty old.

The myth is from people that moved to California from other states. I moved from the the midwest to Southern California. I can't see myself going back to harsh winters and extreme summers. My overall well being has increased and the sunny days helpf with consistent mood levels. This is coming from someone who loved the four seasons and claimed they were required. I realized that humans populate most climates in the w…

You can very much have four seasons without harsh winters and extreme summers though - you can just have regular winters and lovely summers.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#250

Post by barce »

It's still difficult to export very unique tangibles and intangibles from Silicon Valley. The intangibles: a high tolerance for risk and a high degree of insatiable curiosity unfettered by local religious and cultural customs found elsewhere. And these both fostered at the universities. Tangibles: Capital as a result of the largest growth of wealth in human history & the only port in the United States to export more items than it imports - I'm referring to the port of Oakland. The light manufacturing sector is wholly responsible for this and is always underestimated. This sector is always the first to try on Silicon Valley innovations despite such innovations being readily available on the Internet. If anything, these souls leaving are merely setting up satellite bases for Silicon Valley's continued hegemony.
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