The Death of Tony Hsieh: A Spiral of Alcohol, Drugs and Extreme Behavior • Hacker News Board

Re: The Death of Tony Hsieh: A Spiral of Alcohol, Drugs and Extreme Behavior

#231

Post by corin_ » Mon, Dec 07, 2020, 9:33 AM UTC

ibejoeb wrote: post #192

jacobolus wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There have been 1.5 million confirmed Covid deaths, but the total number of people who have died from Covid is far higher than that, I would guess at least 1 million more, but possibly higher. Even wealthy countries with developed healthcare/government infrastructure are missing a significant fraction of deaths (in the USA alone, we have probably missed about 100k Covid deaths from the confirmed count). In many less…

> There have been 1.5 million confirmed Covid deaths It'd really be halpful to frame with some kind of context. TB kills that many annually. To make matters worse, it's a curable disease, so these deaths are entirely unnecessary, but when was the last time you heard a peep about that? It's been raging for decades, and WHO is targeting 2030 as the end of it.

You're ignoring the fact that this is despite huge restrictions around the world to limit its spread, if approached the same way as TB it would do insanely more harm.

Re: The Death of Tony Hsieh: A Spiral of Alcohol, Drugs and Extreme Behavior

#232

Post by zpeti » Mon, Dec 07, 2020, 9:34 AM UTC

DyslexicAtheist wrote: post #210

mlyle wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of the "normal" opportunities for socialization have evaporated, though, leaving only the lunacy and strange ones behind for many people.

I first thought this "only abnormal people left to communicate" comment referred to online communities. But it could also refer to people who ignore the shut-downs and hang out in smaller groups regardless limits on gathering etc. In my country there is no clear distinction of what type of people make up the crowd which is "still" socializing. While you get some pockets of conspiracy theorists, covid-deniers, mixed w…

Let's suppose you're between 20-30 years old, no health issues, and you see your parents/grandparents once a year, or never. You actually think you're a responsible person and if you ever got a temperature or whatever you'd stay home.

I think it would be arguably reasonable for someone like this to socialise right now. The risk is lower than the flu of any complications. The only reason you are being locked down right now is because we have decided governments need to enforce lockdowns on everyone, rather than individuals deciding what's responsible.

I don't think you need to be super crazy, or a covid denier, in the case above, to carry on living your normal life.

Re: The Death of Tony Hsieh: A Spiral of Alcohol, Drugs and Extreme Behavior

#233

Post by PablumPicasso » Mon, Dec 07, 2020, 9:36 AM UTC

bredren wrote: post #150

harrisonjackson wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> every employee/team gets their own mini-fridge That's not startup normal. Maybe having beer and liquor bottles in the kitchen or snack room or whatever but half empty bottles littering the CEO's desk and every employee or even every team having their own mini-fridge is odd. I've worked at startups with a "drinking culture" and startups with a "board game culture" and I'll take the board game culture every time. Doe…

I’d add that casual alcohol use being normalized is not necessary or positive. Alcohol use among high school seniors in the US is on the decline, so is use of any “illicit” drug. [1] I’m no square, but this should be encouraged. Young people already deal with stress of fitting in at a high-velocity workplace. Modeling conspicuous substance consumption at work seems pretty backward to me. Perhaps the most irresponsibl…

> Perhaps the most irresponsible illustration of this is Elon Musk who has made his substance use so overt I think it wrongly and perhaps dangerously couples using to entrepreneurial success.

oh come off it, what substance abuse? he toked on a blunt on JRE once (clearly barely inhaled and even then, so what) and has a few bourbons with his brother on yearly retreats? please provide more info about this, because i've never, ever taken musk to be that sort of guy.

Re: The Death of Tony Hsieh: A Spiral of Alcohol, Drugs and Extreme Behavior

#234

Post by jacobolus » Mon, Dec 07, 2020, 9:38 AM UTC

ibejoeb wrote: post #192

jacobolus wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There have been 1.5 million confirmed Covid deaths, but the total number of people who have died from Covid is far higher than that, I would guess at least 1 million more, but possibly higher. Even wealthy countries with developed healthcare/government infrastructure are missing a significant fraction of deaths (in the USA alone, we have probably missed about 100k Covid deaths from the confirmed count). In many less…

> There have been 1.5 million confirmed Covid deaths It'd really be halpful to frame with some kind of context. TB kills that many annually. To make matters worse, it's a curable disease, so these deaths are entirely unnecessary, but when was the last time you heard a peep about that? It's been raging for decades, and WHO is targeting 2030 as the end of it.

The best current estimate of the IFR of Covid is something like 0.5% with good medical care, or much higher without. If populations take no action whatsoever to curb spread, somewhere between 1/3 and 2/3 of people will likely be infected. If we multiply that by the population of the world, we get something on the order of 15–50 million people dead. Not as bad as the 1918 flu, but worse than any pandemic since, roughly comparable to the entire death toll of AIDS over the past 40 years.

Thankfully all around the world people have taken significant steps to slow the virus down, and so hopefully the vaccine will arrive in time to save tens of millions.

I am happy to agree with you that humanity could do a whole lot more to prevent deaths from infectious diseases, including tuberculosis.

Re: The Death of Tony Hsieh: A Spiral of Alcohol, Drugs and Extreme Behavior

#235

Post by JacobSuperslav » Mon, Dec 07, 2020, 9:38 AM UTC

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #226

bredren wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d add that casual alcohol use being normalized is not necessary or positive. Alcohol use among high school seniors in the US is on the decline, so is use of any “illicit” drug. [1] I’m no square, but this should be encouraged. Young people already deal with stress of fitting in at a high-velocity workplace. Modeling conspicuous substance consumption at work seems pretty backward to me. Perhaps the most irresponsibl…

> Alcohol use among high school seniors in the US is on the decline, so is use of any “illicit” drug. Sounds wholesome, but is probably just the symptom of people going out and socializing less, resulting in increased isolation and loneliness.

hard to say. looking at me and my friends - we've got more time to socialize, plenty of friends, yet people drink less, and definitely use less tobacco(it's really unsexy to smoke cigarettes now, and vaping in public is just embarrassing), because we're more health focused. I have to admit I'm a regular user of psychedelics. drugs are decriminalized where I'm from. unless there will be long term consequences, i don't think it impacted me in any bad way, frankly the opposite, albeit "wasting" some time with friends.

Re: The Death of Tony Hsieh: A Spiral of Alcohol, Drugs and Extreme Behavior

#236

Post by Scoundreller » Mon, Dec 07, 2020, 9:43 AM UTC

sneak wrote: post #229

rsync wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Forgive me ... I am completely naive regarding this subject but find these descriptions both fascinating and confusing... Do I understand: if you're on a whippet bender you have to do a thing every 30 seconds ? It seems like that would interrupt and greatly diminish whatever pleasurable effects the substance was giving you ... in fact, it sounds somewhat stressful ...

You can put 2-3 into a dispensing canister at a time, but yes, every 60-90 seconds it requires interaction. This has probably saved a lot of lives, tbh. It's hard to suffocate yourself if doing so requires motor skills.

In Australia, their paramedics have Penthrox tubes that have an anesthetic in them.

The idea is that the patient can self-administer, but if they over do it, they get too messed up to operate the thing until it wears off again.

Re: The Death of Tony Hsieh: A Spiral of Alcohol, Drugs and Extreme Behavior

#237

Post by imtringued » Mon, Dec 07, 2020, 9:46 AM UTC

zarkov99 wrote: post #115

QuadmasterXLII wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no stigma in the pretty words from HR and massive stigma in the actions of HR

What does HR have to do with anything/?

If you admit you are chronically ill in the workplace you admit you won't ever be as productive as other "healthy" (aka those who didn't admit they are ill) employees. During layoffs you'll be the first to go.

Re: The Death of Tony Hsieh: A Spiral of Alcohol, Drugs and Extreme Behavior

#238

Post by Tempest1981 » Mon, Dec 07, 2020, 9:47 AM UTC

DyslexicAtheist wrote: post #215

ibejoeb wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> how many addicts and people struggling with mental health are being killed ...and how many new addicts and mental illnesses are being created

"The psychological impact of quarantine and how to reduce it: rapid review of the evidence" https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6... quarantine and flattening the curve is important imo, but the way governments go about it is not. there needs to be a parallel campaign educating people about the effects of quarantine - which are well researched. Also I highly recommend reading up on the psycholo…

> a parallel campaign educating people

Although we have some subset of the US population that rebels against being educated. And many others who simply don't have the time, or interest, or intellectual curiousity. We get our education from social media.

Re: The Death of Tony Hsieh: A Spiral of Alcohol, Drugs and Extreme Behavior

#239

Post by skolsuper » Mon, Dec 07, 2020, 9:47 AM UTC

zpeti wrote: post #232

DyslexicAtheist wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I first thought this "only abnormal people left to communicate" comment referred to online communities. But it could also refer to people who ignore the shut-downs and hang out in smaller groups regardless limits on gathering etc. In my country there is no clear distinction of what type of people make up the crowd which is "still" socializing. While you get some pockets of conspiracy theorists, covid-deniers, mixed w…

Let's suppose you're between 20-30 years old, no health issues, and you see your parents/grandparents once a year, or never. You actually think you're a responsible person and if you ever got a temperature or whatever you'd stay home. I think it would be arguably reasonable for someone like this to socialise right now. The risk is lower than the flu of any complications. The only reason you are being locked down righ…

Presumably in this example all grocery store clerks, bar and restaurant service staff, doctors and nurses etc do not have parents and grandparents? Or do they not count for some reason?

Re: The Death of Tony Hsieh: A Spiral of Alcohol, Drugs and Extreme Behavior

#240

Post by piva00 » Mon, Dec 07, 2020, 9:55 AM UTC

rorykoehler wrote: post #209

unishark wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think they meant binge drinking. In many cultures, drinking is fine throughout the day, and it does not imply continuing until drunk.

What's the point in drinking any alcohol at all unless you want to achieve some level of impairment?

I've worked a few times in Germany for onboarding new teams for a company I worked at previously. It's pretty normal to have some lunches with a beer, beer is a very cultural thing for Germans and having a beer during a lunch out with the team is completely normal, no one is impaired, no one is drinking 2-3 liters of beer in one sitting. Even here in Sweden where alcohol drinking is much more frowned upon I've had lunches (usually on Fridays) with my teams where we would have a beer or two.

There are very different degrees of what and how much to drink, it can be a socially responsible and enjoyable activity, it's relaxing to let go from the whole super-professional office culture and have a beer and cheers with colleagues.

The world isn't black-and-white.