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This is Real, That's Not

streetlifesolutions.blogspot.com

231–240 of 364 posts

Re: This is Real, That's Not

#231
post #105

Under the medically justified urgency of covid, Victoria took a significant number of homeless rough sleeping people (as they are called here in australia) into some kind of housing. Queensland did the same using surplus student purpose built dense housing. I'm not going to pretend this "solved the problems" but I am told a number of the less intractable cases got put into a better situation,simply having secure shel…

We have it over and over and over again that housing first is the approach that works. Yet it is very hard for society to stomach the idea of giving someone a handout "no matter what they have done or will do". I don't know why but this seems to be the primary psychic barrier to doing this thing we know works and which can in some cases even be cheaper than services first aid.

The problem with Housing First, like with any Welfare program, it abuse. Housing First programs are ripe for abuse and are abused.

While yes it is cheaper in some ways, the problem is people will be less likely to be creative or lean on personal support networks (i.e couch surfing, live with family, etc) if the government through the taxpayer will just hand you a key to an apartment no questions asked....

There were a couple of times we were technically homeless as a child, I slept many nights on the floor of my grandparents home, or an uncle, etc. so I am not unsympathetic to being in this condition. However I also do not believe government handouts are a solution to the problem

I believe in Handups, but not handouts.

Re: This is Real, That's Not

#232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

May I ask for how long you took that loan? I’m from Germany and a lot of people live here from around $15 000 per year. 150 thousand seems like such a big amount, but I guess life is also more expensive in the US. I just want to understand, because I come from a different perspective.

How well can a person live in Germany for $15,000? A person in the US could live on that much in an apartment with multiple room mates in a city with a low cost of living, but it’s not much of a life. You would be eating Ramen noodle every night (and not the good kind).

Depends on how and where you live.

Goes fron $300-$1000 a month for a shared flat to a single flat.

Re: This is Real, That's Not

#233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How well can a person live in Germany for $15,000? A person in the US could live on that much in an apartment with multiple room mates in a city with a low cost of living, but it’s not much of a life. You would be eating Ramen noodle every night (and not the good kind).

German rents are relatively reasonable: "The price of Monthly rent for a 45 m2 (480 Sqft) furnished studio in NORMAL area in Leipzig is €352" i.e. slightly over $5,000 per year. [Source https://www.expatistan.com/price/studio-rent-normal-area/lei... ]

Wow, that's super cheap! Here in Grand Rapids, MI, USA (generally considered a low cost of living area) an unfurnished apartment in not great parts of town is on the order of $800/mo, plus about $150/mo in utilities, depending on how cold you can tolerate in winter and how hot in summer, i.e. double the price.

Now, actual studio apartments command a premium here, and anything that small is hard to find, you'll more likely find an 80m2/800 sqft converted space in the basement of someone's house for that price. Also, housing is cheaper the farther you go from downtown, and I'm not sure how good public transit is in Leipzig, but it's pretty car-centric here. We have a bus system, but that basically means an extra hour anywhere you want to go, which is a massive pain when you're already working 2 30-hour-per-week jobs.

Re: This is Real, That's Not

#234
post #203
post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There wouldn't be so much contempt for the homeless in California if they weren't allowed throw used needles or defecate everywhere.

What alternative do they have? If we don't provide adequate public loos, or addiction treatment, or injection rooms, or mental health care, we should expect to experience the problems that are caused.

I don't understand why it's so frowned upon in cities like LA to arrest someone for disposing used needles on the ground, and sending them to jail. I'm not going to pretend that it's doing the homeless any favors. However, the alternative of letting them poison themselves with drugs, and I don't see how that's any more humane.

I think the real reason America fails the homeless is not a lack of empathy, but a "it's your fault because you touched it last" mentality. Housing first requires people who work with social workers. These people already draw a lot of ire when they fail or deemed as too harsh.

Re: This is Real, That's Not

#235
post #105

Under the medically justified urgency of covid, Victoria took a significant number of homeless rough sleeping people (as they are called here in australia) into some kind of housing. Queensland did the same using surplus student purpose built dense housing. I'm not going to pretend this "solved the problems" but I am told a number of the less intractable cases got put into a better situation,simply having secure shel…

I like the observations you make, and I think you are correct in them. I object to this though: "Collective failure of imagination" There is so much wrong with that statement, I barely know where to start. Government is a collection of individuals. Individuals do have imagination. But in this case, no imagination is even required - as you point out there is the previous 9 months of data. What we find is no interest i…

Yeah, probably not. You might as well say that "carpet" means "a domestic animal that inhabits your automobile", because "car"+"pet".

Generally speaking, you can't get at the meaning of a word by decomposing it into its etymological roots, even if you're lucky or educated enough to pick the correct roots.

For a nice (heh) example of why, look up the etymology of the word "nice", for example, here:

https://www.etymonline.com/word/nice

Re: This is Real, That's Not

#236
post #10
post #4

Fantastic read! Always remember that "money doesn't buy happiness" is the shibboleth for people who always had money. Bring that up next time someone says it. Fun reaction guaranteed. I like to follow it up with my favorite slavic saying: "Sure money won't make you happy, but crying in a Ferrari is much nicer than on the bus"

Easily the worst time of my life was during a 1 year eviction. I even dated a girl for a brief period who told me the ' you can always have a good attitude' thing. Years later when a met someone else struggling to find safe housing, I told them 'always stay positive, attitude' is bullshit. Allow yourself to be upset. Money buys security. Security means one less thing to worry about. I'm very grateful for the career I…

The “good attitude” line is a form of toxic positivity, actually. Getting evicted sucks and it’s perfectly rational to be upset about it. What matters is how you move on from it, and you did and it sounds like your life is much better now.

Re: This is Real, That's Not

#237

Dear Doreen (hopefully you spot this), thank you for an amazing article -- and also congrats on your recent first pull request, no small feat! :) I have a question for you; I've been hoping for an opportunity to ask a person who could answer this genuinely (something that I could not guarantee by asking just anyone off the street). What is the best way for someone like me (a non-homeless person who wants to help), to…

Thank you. The pull request was a big moment for me.

When I was homeless, random acts of kindness were a godsend and I generally preferred cash, but sometimes a jacket or blanket in cold weather was hugely helpful and even better than cash at that moment. Occasionally, someone gifted me a hotel stay and it made a big difference.

I wrote some about those ideas here:

http://whathelpsthehomeless.blogspot.com/2015/01/random-acts...

http://whathelpsthehomeless.blogspot.com/2017/02/cash-and-gi...

http://whathelpsthehomeless.blogspot.com/2016/12/hotel-stays...

http://whathelpsthehomeless.blogspot.com/2016/11/free-clean-...

To be clear, I never begged or made up stories about having lost my but ticket or whatever. People just sometimes identified me as homeless and did things like offered to pay my grocery tab as I was checking out or handed me a gift card or handed me a blanket. I think you would maybe need to think a bit about how to spot homeless people in situations where it would make sense to do that sort of thing to feel confident this isn't some con game.

One of the problems with "trying to help the homeless" is the Shirky Principle: "Organizations will tend to preserve the problem to which they are the solution." If you really want to see fewer homeless people on the street, it's best to work to find ways to prevent homelessness and reduce the incidence of it as opposed to focusing solely on helping those already out in the street.

Yes, people who are currently out in the street desperately need some help. But the one thing I most wanted help with while homeless was help trying to establish an earned income so I could get my life back and almost no one took me seriously on that point. I was viewed as a "charity case" and no one anyone would want to pay for services.

Someone on Metafilter once characterized my efforts to monetize my websites as me "panhandling the internet." Meanwhile, Metafilter brags about providing well-paid cushy work for it's paid moderating staff and takes donations for their site since their ad money was infamously cut by some change in the Adsense algorithm. But me taking donations for my writing was somehow "different" from what they were doing and "bad."

I've run into similar issues since getting off the street. For a time, I did volunteer work for local charities that nominally do economic development. I quit all my volunteer work back in May of this year. They wouldn't help me establish a better income and didn't really want to pay me (even when there was a payment agreement, they made me feel like I was misbehaving to expect my check in a timely fashion), while eager to give me more unpaid volunteer work because I was getting things done.

It's an insidious form of classism that says "We like what you do, but we don't think you deserve to be paid because you are too poor to dress right" or something. It's a trap that's shockingly hard to escape: I'm too poor for anyone to think I deserve a middle class wage for my work, even if I am doing good quality work, so I can't get rich enough to dress well enough to signal socially that I deserve a middle class wage for my work. People want more of that work from me but they want it for free on the justification that I don't dress right or some nonsense.

In the US, I would like to see universal health care coverage and I would like to see changes to our housing policies. There is a shocking shortage of "affordable housing" -- unfortunately, that's a really loaded term. It means a particular thing to most people. I mean it as literally as possible, but it is perhaps best to describe what I mean and that is smaller homes in walkable neighborhoods available at a modest price even though it is market rate housing and not some kind of homeless program.

A lot of people on the street have some income, just not enough to support a middle class lifestyle. Cost of housing and inability to find inexpensive housing that supports a car-free lifestyle are two big challenges in the US for the sorts of people who end up on the street.

I would be all for someone starting a business that builds Missing Middle housing as a for profit endeavor or that builds SROs as a for profit endeavor. In many places in the US, we have thrown up zoning barriers to building Missing Middle housing and we have torn down a million SROs in the US in recent decades. SROs used to be normal market-rate housing for ordinary people with ordinary jobs who just wanted to rent a room. Now, we think of them solely as part of some homeless program to help people get off the street, and that means that ordinary people with not much money get forced into being "charity cases" instead of having humble but independent lives.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_room_occupancy

I think if you want to be helpful in this space, it's useful to keep two things in mind:

1. On an individual basis: The sorts of problems that lead to homelessness can be hard to remedy, so even if they are making a sincere effort, it can take a long time to see results. (So don't expect a one-time gift of cash or something to magically remedy their situation.)

2. On a societal level: In a perfect world, we would do a better job of caring for "the people" such that having some kind of personal issue would be less likely to cause your life to come unraveled and land you on the street. That means doing a better job addressing basic needs like health care, housing, transportation even if someone can't drive for some reason and so forth and doing so simply because people exist and not based on them finally being desperate enough to qualify for some needs-based program or other.

Re: This is Real, That's Not

#238
post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlike in Europe, in the US going to university or college requires huge amounts of money and usually require students to take loans. And unlike other types of loans it is nearly impossible to declare bankruptcy for student loans. There is a great summarising it: https://youtu.be/pVKEsiNMPNc

Father of 3 here, one recently graduated and one about to start US college. With reasonable preparation, college is very affordable. Scholarships are easily obtained with a good ACT or SAT score. Both of these are well documented, a few months of self-study practically guarantees a good score. My experience has been that good preparation puts out of pocket costs below $10k per year. (I think that's actually on the hi…

> Scholarships are easily obtained with a good ACT or SAT score.

For the children of people that read Hacker News, I could see that. For normal American kids? No way. Not even close.

The average american kid is not going to be able to get an SAT or ACT score good enough to get a scholarship. It's just not going to happen. You're vastly overestimating how smart and committed they are.

How much effort do you expect a kid to put into something that has no immediate benefit and no guarantee it'll ever pay off? To get to that level of delayed gratification requires a very special sort of upbringing.

Re: This is Real, That's Not

#239
post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the UK. Although it's not a normal loan in that repayments are linked to income and there is a promise that it will be "forgiven" at retirement (which I'm a little skeptical of)

The UK loans are actually a good deal if you really understand them, which students here inevitably don’t. It makes demanding government to pay for tuition here pretty abhorrent imho. I know a lot of working class/blue-collar families here, and talking with them, it really becomes clear how incredibly selfish and unreasonable it is to expect their taxes to buy someone wealthier than them an education that they themse…

I'm entirely incapable of understanding how a UK SLC "loan" can be considered a loan in the conventional sense of the word when it seems to have literally no characteristics of a loan, and every characteristic of a tax:

* You only pay it when you are in employment and earning money (with a minimum salary for repayments to be taken);

* The repayments are calculated as a function of your taxable income;

* The balance isn't discharged by bankruptcy;

* The balance isn't considered by lenders when assessing your suitability to take on "real" debt.

As far as I can tell, it's a graduate tax (on those who took a loan) for all intents and purposes.

I see comments from students talking about being "crushed by debt" as a result of taking an SLC loan, and I just can't work out where this perception comes from: yes, it decreases your take-home pay, but since there's a minimum salary threshold for payments to be taken, it's never going to leave you destitute.

Re: This is Real, That's Not

#240
post #7

What a great read. This resonates with me. At one point in my life I was desperately close to homelessness. At the time I was lucky to still be enrolled at a university and could therefore easily take out as many loans as I needed. It was a horribly risky gamble I wouldn’t wish on anyone, but without going into more details of my life story I barely managed to graduate and find a successful career. I was able to pay…

May I ask for how long you took that loan? I’m from Germany and a lot of people live here from around $15 000 per year. 150 thousand seems like such a big amount, but I guess life is also more expensive in the US. I just want to understand, because I come from a different perspective.

You're saying they make $15k a year after or before taxes? Or that is their yearly expenses?
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