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“I've had to relearn coding to get through the new interviews”

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Re: “I've had to relearn coding to get through the new interviews”

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Haven’t worked at fb but same experience at other big co. Also I question authors experience interviewing people - I’ve done literally hundreds coding sessions and there’re surprisingly large number of folks who claim 5-10 years of experience and several companies under their belt but aren’t able to code a simple for-loop in their language of choice

A simple for-loop? that's ridiculous. If that's really the case I wonder the screening abilities of recruiters more than candidates.

> A simple for-loop? that's ridiculous.

It's not. People STILL fail FizzBuzz. Every day.

Re: “I've had to relearn coding to get through the new interviews”

#132
post #124

Unless you've made it to your "endgame" company that you're happy to stay at for a while, I feel investing anything more than the bare minimum to get your assigned work done is worth less than just grinding leetcode and otherwise studying for interviews. Doing an actual good job, above and beyond, is not going to be worth much when you're looking for your next job. Thus we're now seeing the rise of Professional Inter…

And what about job satisfaction, not doing an actual good job and spending miserable time doing leetcode is not going to add much worth to my day to day happiness. I instead always suggest to do a good job regardless (note that doesn't mean doing long hours just working with care). There are more important things than career ladder like integrity, honesty, work ethic and meaningful work. Don't let societal policies c…

I can't over-stress how important this is. Societal trends come and go, and unfit ones eventually go. Stand your ground, and do the right thing, always. You won't necessarily win if you do, but you will lose yourself if you don't.

Re: “I've had to relearn coding to get through the new interviews”

#133

The author has been working as a developer for 15 years, and claims very strong technical skills. Why are they learning/re-learning Python, C++, SQL, C#, college math? Nobody will be fooled by that; at 15 YoE they will be evaluated on what they have done over a career, not over the last month. > it's all about how much time you can spend on Leetcode. The author is playing a game built for new grads. Here's a secret,…

That's nonsense. I've got 20 YoE, an elite college degree, tons of experience in Python and C++, have single-handedly put together mission critical software systems, and I can't get my foot in the door outside my small area of expertise. The teams I've worked on are tiny, so I have no career network to draw from. I'm missing machine learning and cloud experience, and my resume gets no hits because of it. Age 44, and…

There's some other problem. None of us can say what it is unless you share your resume, what companies you've applied to, etc. But if you get "no hits" with 20 years of experience in Python and C++, the problem is 100% not "missing machine learning and cloud experience".

Re: “I've had to relearn coding to get through the new interviews”

#134
post #7

> It's also an opportunity to excuse ageism. Yep!

nonsense. its your one chance to defeat ageism by just winning the fucking game.

"the game" is something I think some older folks are tired of playing.

https://dev.to/bytebodger/why-older-people-struggle-in-progr...

Re: “I've had to relearn coding to get through the new interviews”

#135
post #4

Generally, I'm more likely to hire someone with interesting hobbies than someone who has completed HackerRank tests. I don't find it compelling to see that a candidate has accomplished standardized metrics; but I am swayed by non-computing hobbies. Synthesizers, painting, rock climbing, volunteering, and so on are indicators of a curious mind that's happy to apply itself.

How many Petabytes of data are you working with? Maybe your company is too small for data structures and cutting every 0.1ms latency count. As an example at Google I needed director level exception to introduce 0.1ms latency to the ads server (which wasn't needed at the end, but the monetary damage for timeouts is real). Understanding basic data structures and how the computer works is important in these cases, even…

Fair, but for those unaware, ads infra at Google etc. are a class of their own because it's the starkest place in the pipeline where latency = -$. More like high-speed trading fintech than regular engineering. They don't care anywhere near as much about services (possibly--but possibly not even--google.com).

Re: “I've had to relearn coding to get through the new interviews”

#136

The author has been working as a developer for 15 years, and claims very strong technical skills. Why are they learning/re-learning Python, C++, SQL, C#, college math? Nobody will be fooled by that; at 15 YoE they will be evaluated on what they have done over a career, not over the last month. > it's all about how much time you can spend on Leetcode. The author is playing a game built for new grads. Here's a secret,…

That's nonsense. I've got 20 YoE, an elite college degree, tons of experience in Python and C++, have single-handedly put together mission critical software systems, and I can't get my foot in the door outside my small area of expertise. The teams I've worked on are tiny, so I have no career network to draw from. I'm missing machine learning and cloud experience, and my resume gets no hits because of it. Age 44, and…

> my resume gets no hits > Maybe someone will notice me there.

I'm not sure if expecting them to come to you is a winning strategy. But you could get someone to review your CV to see if the presentation of it can be improved ?

I also have more than 20 years of experience, and if anyone asks me more than a fleeting question on what I did in college, that would be a massive red flag for me. I feel that even if I'm new to a certain technology, my overall experience is helpful and valued. The grey beard perspective so to say.

And getting some experience with machine learning has never been easier. Play around with TensorFlow, or buy one of those Nvidia Jetson dev kits and follow the free Nvidia AI courses. And there's plenty of things on Coursera, fast.ai and the likes for more formal insights beyond experimenting.

Same with cloud, free tiers everywhere. But it takes effort to learn these new technologies, and that is not always easy at an age where more life has happened than for a recent graduate. So we need to be a bit smarter and efficient at it, but it can still be done.

Edit: I actually checked your Linkedin that you posted in another comment. I personally don't feel it's a bad CV, but I can see how it might not be a CV for FAANG companies. And you are already doing my suggestion of learning the newer stuff.

But I've experienced two things that might apply in your case as well. You're self-employed, which tends to reduce the people reaching for employee positions as they might think you're not interested at all. Secondly, you seem to be working remotely, which reduces opportunities even further.

I'm just wondering if recruiters commonly reach out to experienced developers that are self-employed in a remote capacity with a strong history of real world applications. Maybe a recruiter here can chime in ?

But it does seem you could use some more networking.

Anyway, best of luck !

Re: “I've had to relearn coding to get through the new interviews”

#137
post #55

Unless you've made it to your "endgame" company that you're happy to stay at for a while, I feel investing anything more than the bare minimum to get your assigned work done is worth less than just grinding leetcode and otherwise studying for interviews. Doing an actual good job, above and beyond, is not going to be worth much when you're looking for your next job. Thus we're now seeing the rise of Professional Inter…

Our industry feels like it's in the decline of the Roman Empire right now. Our craft is becoming arcane: Microsoft is building VSCode for the cloud. Few people own desktop computers anymore. Apple is locking down MacOS to signed binaries. Soon we'll all have thin clients and will write software in the cloud for the cloud. Few will be able to learn how to engineer at home anymore - you'll have to go to a university or…

> Our industry feels like it's in the decline of the Roman Empire right now. ....

And here I am, writing a desktop native app that targets a small niche of users, with no marketing, no advertising, and we've had our strongest year yet, and overall usage just grows slowly year over year.

Maybe it's how you think things ought to be that is misaligned with reality, rather than "the decline of the Roman Empire".

Re: “I've had to relearn coding to get through the new interviews”

#138

The author has been working as a developer for 15 years, and claims very strong technical skills. Why are they learning/re-learning Python, C++, SQL, C#, college math? Nobody will be fooled by that; at 15 YoE they will be evaluated on what they have done over a career, not over the last month. > it's all about how much time you can spend on Leetcode. The author is playing a game built for new grads. Here's a secret,…

That's nonsense. I've got 20 YoE, an elite college degree, tons of experience in Python and C++, have single-handedly put together mission critical software systems, and I can't get my foot in the door outside my small area of expertise. The teams I've worked on are tiny, so I have no career network to draw from. I'm missing machine learning and cloud experience, and my resume gets no hits because of it. Age 44, and…

I recommend joining a Python meetup. It can be a simple way to grow your network and have free pizza and beer.

Now, with respect to cloud... it's not that hard to learn. If you have system administration skills it should not be a real challenge for you.

Now, people in the industry did not wake up one day and conspire to radically change how things work. It has been a gradual change over many years... that's why it's important to stay informed of new trends and technologies.

Re: “I've had to relearn coding to get through the new interviews”

#139

The author has been working as a developer for 15 years, and claims very strong technical skills. Why are they learning/re-learning Python, C++, SQL, C#, college math? Nobody will be fooled by that; at 15 YoE they will be evaluated on what they have done over a career, not over the last month. > it's all about how much time you can spend on Leetcode. The author is playing a game built for new grads. Here's a secret,…

Haven’t worked at fb but same experience at other big co. Also I question authors experience interviewing people - I’ve done literally hundreds coding sessions and there’re surprisingly large number of folks who claim 5-10 years of experience and several companies under their belt but aren’t able to code a simple for-loop in their language of choice

This is fair comment - there are definitely experienced devs who really are not up to scratch.

But - there are tons who are great devs, unwilling to 'play the leetcode game'.

So both those things can be true at the same time.

Re: “I've had to relearn coding to get through the new interviews”

#140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Working hard for a raise/promotion is a losing strategy. Working hard so you can change jobs every 18-24 months with big salary jumps is rather easy to do consistently. Trying to get a promotion is deciding to compete for one position in one company with essentially every qualified candidate in the world. It’s easy to see how looking for a better job every so often has better odds for success.

I don't think so at all. I have worked hard, and had a lot of fun at now two of the FAANG's. Sure the reward has not been like winning the startup lottery, but if you told myself 20 years ago I would have this impact and earn this much money I would not have believed it. I totally suck at politics, and have seen others rise quicker, but doing good work does get rewarded in my experience.

I would think FAANG would be considered as "endgame company" for many. Including myself.
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