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Google illegally spied on workers before firing them, US labor board alleges

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Re: Google illegally spied on workers before firing them, US labor board alleges

#231

Post by JMTQp8lwXL »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #191

True story, a person I know who was offered a job at Google got the employment agreement (prior to arriving which was pretty standard at the time) and read that bit about "allowing Google to protect it's IP by installing a rootkit" and they red lined it to change it "May only access Google related information and no personal information." When they showed up HR started with "But that isn't how we use it, we would nev…

You'd think they'd offer the guy a job still, but without the contract changes, instead of immediately pulling out. It sounds like he was firm, but given a chance to take the job without said changes, he may still have accepted. Geez.

It is unreasonable and in bad faith to completely like a candidate and then reject them for merely asking for a contract change.

Re: Google illegally spied on workers before firing them, US labor board alleges

#232

Post by e40 »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #191

True story, a person I know who was offered a job at Google got the employment agreement (prior to arriving which was pretty standard at the time) and read that bit about "allowing Google to protect it's IP by installing a rootkit" and they red lined it to change it "May only access Google related information and no personal information." When they showed up HR started with "But that isn't how we use it, we would nev…

Does this mean you are required to have an Android phone? What if you have an iPhone? Rootkit required there, too?

Re: Google illegally spied on workers before firing them, US labor board alleges

#233

Post by Teknoman117 »

desireco42 wrote: post #202

It is super convenient to have work stuff with you all the time. So you can step out and be available. Google work profiles solve this for me. I deal with sensitive information anyway. So it is separated so much that it is hard to even share links with colleagues but once you switch to work profile on Android phone (OnePlus FTW!) it works well. I am surprised this is issue in Google.

I'm very curious if the work profiles are as containerized as they are advertised as.

Re: Google illegally spied on workers before firing them, US labor board alleges

#234

Post by giantg2 »

corpMaverick wrote: post #206
giantg2 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And that makes it ok to do the same? If so, then that justifies others to insult you.

I haven't spent my life insulting people. He does. False equivalence.

How is it false equivalence? What metrics show that you spent your life not insulting people and that another person did, and how do people know that? Care to quantify it? Where's the line? Maybe to me the line is a single insult. I mean, given the sample size of my interaction with you, maybe that single insult would meet the threshold of insults/compliments when compared to the insults/ compliments of another person over 4 years, even if there are more examples of insults due to sample size.

Re: Google illegally spied on workers before firing them, US labor board alleges

#235

Post by realityking »

willcipriano wrote: post #211
MereInterest wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't it great when even something as huge and life-changing as a job is subject to a contract of adhesion with no negotiation allowed? I'm sure glad to live in such a free country with great worker rights. (Sarcasm intended.)

I have no idea how those contracts are enforceable. Quit your job, move across the country and then on your first day here are nine contracts to sign, no you can't take them home we need them now. If you don't sign you are unemployed and we want that relocation money back. I used to ask potential employers when I got deep into interviews with them. "Is there any way I can see all the contracts I would need to sign on…

I was un are of this system until I hired in the US. It blows my mind.

Here (Germany) offer letters are used to outline the general terms of an offer however the next step will then be that you’re sent a contract (some of mine have been > 10 pages) outlining a lot of relevant things such: - role (ideally even with a job description but that is rare) - place of employment (city/country) - IP assignment - length of probation - length of notice period for both sides - expectation of work travel - vacation - compensation

And a bunch of other things that I’m forgetting.

Similar to the above story, there’s always some resistance from employers to customize terms. It’s operationally much simpler for a company to have unified terms. However at every company I’ve been at I’ve been able to secure changes to the IP assignment clauses.

Of course all of this only works because these contracts are enforceable. There’s no such thing as at will employment here.

Re: Google illegally spied on workers before firing them, US labor board alleges

#236

Post by dheera »

e40 wrote: post #232
ChuckMcM wrote: post #191

True story, a person I know who was offered a job at Google got the employment agreement (prior to arriving which was pretty standard at the time) and read that bit about "allowing Google to protect it's IP by installing a rootkit" and they red lined it to change it "May only access Google related information and no personal information." When they showed up HR started with "But that isn't how we use it, we would nev…

Does this mean you are required to have an Android phone? What if you have an iPhone? Rootkit required there, too?

Google probably has their corporate app for iOS too.

Just have a phone with an obscure OS and escape all compatibility with their corporate crap. They should provide you with a phone if they want you to install their corporate app.

Re: Google illegally spied on workers before firing them, US labor board alleges

#237

Post by dheera »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #212
cooljacob204 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With android work profiles I don't think it's that big a deal. It's isolated from my phone, my employer can't see anything outside the profile and I just disable it on weekends/vacations.

Fun fact: If a judge orders you to surrender your phone because it might contain evidence relating to a case, it doesn't matter how you've segregated data on your phone. Sometimes businesses literally put some services on different physical boxes in case a court sees fit to collect the entire machine. If you had a bunch of other VMs on it... shrug .

We need an OS that self-destructs all data if surrendered, and that should be a hardcoded feature of the OS.

Something like a fingerprint scanner that needs to be scanned at least once every 24 hours or all data gets erased.

Re: Google illegally spied on workers before firing them, US labor board alleges

#238

Post by staticassertion »

ditonal wrote: post #40

One thing that happens in SV is: * Employer says "hey, we have all these convenient corporate app, wouldn't it be nice to be able to check work messages and work docs on your mobile? Just install our app to "corp-ify" your phone" * Employer now views your mobile device as containing sensitive company IP and therefore they have the right to snoop on anything on your phone. If you install corp on your phone, Google vie…

Seems weird. We have MDM at my company and there's no way I can "spy" on your phone or otherwise perform rootkit like work. It all goes through a work profile, which is isolated from your personal apps/ information.

Re: Google illegally spied on workers before firing them, US labor board alleges

#239

Post by joshuamorton »

dylan604 wrote: post #209
joshuamorton wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would my personal phone come under a work-related deposition? Work emails written on my phone might be, but those are accessible without physically taking my phone.

Because some lawyer convinced a judge that there may be pertinent information on it. If there's any suspicion that you may have used your personal device to communicate with co-workers, then they'll want to see it. You can't prove you didn't without turning it over. If they find you didn't use it, then thanks. If they find you did, game over. That's the point of the discovery process. They don't know what information…

> If there's any suspicion that you may have used your personal device to communicate with co-workers, then they'll want to see it.

No, they'll want to see the communication. Which the company will be compelled to provide. The device isn't relevant. (In my, admittedly limited, experience, this is how these processes actually work)

Re: Google illegally spied on workers before firing them, US labor board alleges

#240

Post by avery42 »

stronglikedan wrote: post #133
eschneider wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does it flag me as an old that the last thing on earth I want to do is check work messages/docs from my phone? There's a concept of 'checking out for the day and going home' that's important to not going crazy, especially now. If something goes wrong, or there's an emergency, folks have a number they can text/call. But constantly check messages? No way.

I'm in the middle. I have developers that work whenever they feel like it, and they email me with questions at all hours. I like to be there for them when I can (but I don't feel bad when I can't). I've set up my email client on my phone, so that it only notifies me if one of my developers emails me. I use the VIP feature of Samsung's email client, which seems to be unique to that specific client, since I haven't bee…

> I've set up my email client on my phone, so that it only notifies me if one of my developers emails me. I use the VIP feature of Samsung's email client, which seems to be unique to that specific client, since I haven't been able to find another with it.

Maybe not quite as simple to set up, but you should be able to get something similar on most clients with a folder and a filter. I've done this for some of my important/urgent folders, with K9-Mail set to only show notifications from those folders (notification class).

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