How to Escape the Modern Rat Race • Hacker News Board

Re: How to Escape the Modern Rat Race

#21

Post by fairity » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 6:26 PM UTC

AlexandrB wrote: post #16

fairity wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regardless of whether or not it accurately explains the term’s origin or true meaning, the Venn diagram seems to present the more compelling idea.

I disagree. The Venn diagram version positions satisfaction as contingent on things you cannot possibly control ("That Which the World Needs" and "That Which You Can be Paid For"). This is a recipe for perpetual unhappiness and dissatisfaction for most.

I agree that it's best to choose values that are within your control. Once you choose intrinsic values, you'll generally find that you need to make money to best align your actions with your values.

The question, then, is how do you balance: 1) making enough money for food and shelter with 2) your intrinsic values? Also, will making more than enough money help you further achieve your values?

The diagram presents a framework to find an optimal solution. "That which you love" is a function of your intrinsic values. The other 3 circles will help you efficiently convert your time into money to support what you love. I guess the better diagram would somehow convey the fact that, ultimately, what really matters is that which you love.

Re: How to Escape the Modern Rat Race

#22

Post by proverbialbunny » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 6:29 PM UTC

keenmaster wrote: post #4

proverbialbunny wrote: post #2

For anyone who has not heard of the word ikigai, I highly recommend googling it. While not possible for everyone, and not easy for everyone to achieve, ikigai is the ultimate goal. If you can achieve that, you're outside of the rat race.

Just in case people see the misleading "ikigai" Venn diagram https://medium.com/@support_35468/ikigai-is-not-a-venn-diagr...

Oh geez. I did mean the venn diagram + more.

The venn diagram has helped me. I'm lucky to be blessed to be in the center of it. In my experience, the venn diagram is correct. It represents what I've gone through quite well.

Re: How to Escape the Modern Rat Race

#23

Post by fairity » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 6:34 PM UTC

gbrown wrote: post #17

zant wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would add self-enhancement to this. I recently started to exercise with rings and go on deeper math, and every progress is very rewarding. I think this apply to anything one may choose.

I was talking with my brother about this, and he called it “intellectual hedonism”. Never really thought about it that way, but it’s not entirely incorrect.

I've thought about this a bit and came to the same conclusion. Most people who value self-growth are ultimately doing so as a means to achieve vain values. That is, the reason you want to continue growing is because you want to be better than others, or build wealth or status. You may trick your mind into thinking you genuinely enjoy self-improvement, but I've found that the moment to moment experience of self-improvement is often grueling and if you enjoy the process, it's most likely because of one of these vain values. The exception is if you happened to have parents who instilled self-growth as a primary value throughout your childhood -- then, it will actually feel like an end in of itself.

Ultimately, I think people will be better off choosing intrinsic values that are not conditional on external forces or comparison to others. That said, as long as you can achieve your values, however vain they may be, more power to you!

Re: How to Escape the Modern Rat Race

#24

Post by melenaboija » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 6:37 PM UTC

Being from Europe and having spent the last 6 years in the US I feel this is way more accentuated here.

I always thought the fact of putting your life in true risk because of your financial situation could be one of the reasons (lack of public health). And this extends to public education, retirement plans, ... which forces people to the competition.

Just an opinion based on my personal experience though

Re: How to Escape the Modern Rat Race

#25

Post by piercebot » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 6:38 PM UTC

keenmaster wrote: post #4

proverbialbunny wrote: post #2

For anyone who has not heard of the word ikigai, I highly recommend googling it. While not possible for everyone, and not easy for everyone to achieve, ikigai is the ultimate goal. If you can achieve that, you're outside of the rat race.

Just in case people see the misleading "ikigai" Venn diagram https://medium.com/@support_35468/ikigai-is-not-a-venn-diagr...

Thanks for sharing. This post makes a lot of sense, and I think it jives more closely with the original (How to Escape the Modern Rat Race) post when it comes to finding meaning or purpose in life.

Re: How to Escape the Modern Rat Race

#26

Post by birdsbirdsbirds » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 6:39 PM UTC

This article is not about escaping the rat race but about winning it. Reinvesting and having long-term goals is just the best strategy to make the most. It's kind of doubling down on the rat race.

The status game is actually a valid strategy since, unlike developers, most people don't live in a merit-based society. Strong people associate with strong people. So whoever needs resources also has to appear strong. For non-developers, it's pitch day every day.

The easiest way to escape the rat race is to keep racing. Not to win, but to race.

Re: How to Escape the Modern Rat Race

#27

Post by cmehdy » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 6:40 PM UTC

keenmaster wrote: post #4

proverbialbunny wrote: post #2

For anyone who has not heard of the word ikigai, I highly recommend googling it. While not possible for everyone, and not easy for everyone to achieve, ikigai is the ultimate goal. If you can achieve that, you're outside of the rat race.

Just in case people see the misleading "ikigai" Venn diagram https://medium.com/@support_35468/ikigai-is-not-a-venn-diagr...

Ikigai seems to be embodied in the "iyashi-kei", "slice-of-life" genre of Japanese manga and anime. From older titles like Azumanga and YKK (Yokohama Kaidashi Kikou), to Aria / Aqua, K-On, and even series with a bit more activity like the wonderful Mushishi (recommended to anyone without exception).

Re: How to Escape the Modern Rat Race

#28

Post by war1025 » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 6:40 PM UTC

georgeecollins wrote: post #9

I really like this point of view, but it is important to point out that the bar for happiness in life and relationships (as a proxy for "reproduction) is way below our aspirations. You aren't really trying to be like Instagram influenceres because of your "selfish gene". Your "selfish gene" would do better directing you toward fundamentalist communities where reproductive rates are higher. No, you are being influence…

> No, you are being influenced by media, which convinces you that things are a proxy for happiness and good relationships

The Fight Club line has always really resonated with me:

"We work jobs we hate to buy shit we don't need"

Live below your means. Tune out from all the consumerism. Suddenly you find that you have enough savings built up that you could support yourself for multiple years without working. Now you are no longer willing to put up with as much at work. Oddly, this builds a sort of respect from people and they bother you less. Now you have excellent work life balance and more than you could ever want.

And really the key to it all is just not wanting so much.

(Also try to keep the freak-accident / illness destroying your life type stuff out your mind.)

Re: How to Escape the Modern Rat Race

#29

Post by lotsofpulp » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 6:44 PM UTC

war1025 wrote: post #28

georgeecollins wrote: post #9

I really like this point of view, but it is important to point out that the bar for happiness in life and relationships (as a proxy for "reproduction) is way below our aspirations. You aren't really trying to be like Instagram influenceres because of your "selfish gene". Your "selfish gene" would do better directing you toward fundamentalist communities where reproductive rates are higher. No, you are being influence…

> No, you are being influenced by media, which convinces you that things are a proxy for happiness and good relationships The Fight Club line has always really resonated with me: "We work jobs we hate to buy shit we don't need" Live below your means. Tune out from all the consumerism. Suddenly you find that you have enough savings built up that you could support yourself for multiple years without working. Now you ar…

This works without kids. If you have kids, then typically you desire to give them the best available options, and that then means living in higher priced neighborhoods with higher achieving student populations. And then your kid befriends another kid whose parents are doctors/lawyers/engineers/business owners, and they want to don vacation or camp with them and you need to pony up a few hundred or thousand dollars and so on and so forth.

Re: How to Escape the Modern Rat Race

#30

Post by georgeecollins » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 6:45 PM UTC

mgolawala wrote: post #19

georgeecollins wrote: post #9

I really like this point of view, but it is important to point out that the bar for happiness in life and relationships (as a proxy for "reproduction) is way below our aspirations. You aren't really trying to be like Instagram influenceres because of your "selfish gene". Your "selfish gene" would do better directing you toward fundamentalist communities where reproductive rates are higher. No, you are being influence…

Hasn't Human nature itself been crafted by evolutionary forces? It is conceivable that our ancestors that were more laid back and content were more likely to be out competed by those who were hungry for power and prestige. In fact, as an example, isn't there some often quoted statistic about half a percentage of all living humans having descended from Genghis Khan?

Human nature may be crafted by evolutionary forces, but that doesn't mean that human behavious do is always in service of biological evolution.

The idea about people coming from Genghis Khan is unrepresentative in a couple ways. First, that a large number of people have a common ancestor does not mean that the common ancestor was in fact Genghis Khan. It could have been someone else associated with the Mongol conquest.

Second, six hundred years from now you or I may have a lot of ancestors, assuming you have kids (I already do). There is nothing remarkable about that.