Pfizer Covid vaccine approved for use next week in UK • Hacker News Board

Re: Pfizer Covid vaccine approved for use next week in UK

#311

Post by Angostura » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 2:27 PM UTC

ulrikrasmussen wrote: post #158

mystcb wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

UK Gov originally published this as the priority interim list [1] - * older adults’ resident in a care home and care home workers * all those 80 years of age and over and health and social care workers * all those 75 years of age and over * all those 70 years of age and over * all those 65 years of age and over * high-risk adults under 65 years of age * moderate-risk adults under 65 years of age * all those 60 years…

In Denmark where I live, a large proportion of infected people are age 20-29, and I wonder if it would make sense to vaccinate them first when you get to "rest of the population". Even though they have a smaller risk of getting seriously ill, that could be an effective way to lower transmission. That is: 1. Immunize the age group that is dominating in the hospitalization statistics, then 2. Immunize the age group is…

We don't know yet whether the vaccine stops people from being asymptomic spreaders. We do know that it is effective at stopping people from getting ill.

So we don't know how beneficial your 2 above would be.

Re: Pfizer Covid vaccine approved for use next week in UK

#312

Post by gns24 » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 2:30 PM UTC

spuz wrote: post #305

nmca wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My understanding is that that trial condition (half->full) was administered accidentally (thus not pre-registered) and nobody expected it to work better, and the sample size is small and on the wrong age groups.

This doesn't matter though. The results are still valid.

No, the results are not valid, or at least not in a useful way. The group who have received the wrong dose isn't a random sample from the treatment group, so we don't know whether it's more effective or not. It could even be less so.

I don't know what the regulator will do about this situation; it's clear that the vaccine is effective in at least one of the dosing regimes administered, but being entirely certain as to which is better is probably impossible to determine from the data available.

Re: Pfizer Covid vaccine approved for use next week in UK

#313

Post by lm2s » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 2:32 PM UTC

varispeed wrote: post #233

mkolodny wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the CDC: "People who have gotten sick with COVID-19 may still benefit from getting vaccinated. Due to the severe health risks associated with COVID-19 and the fact that re-infection with COVID-19 is possible, people may be advised to get a COVID-19 vaccine even if they have been sick with COVID-19 before." https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/vaccine-b... .

This doesn't explain why it will benefit someone. The text is alarmingly vague.

> Due to the severe health risks associated with COVID-19 and the fact that re-infection with COVID-19 is possible (...)

Re: Pfizer Covid vaccine approved for use next week in UK

#314

Post by J-dawg » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 2:33 PM UTC

spuz wrote: post #310

J-dawg wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Conversely, I am finding the reaction to anti-vaccine sentiment from some politicians to be pretty creepy. Already there is talk of compulsory vaccination or "vaccine passports". Labour (the UK opposition party) were even calling for spreading "misinformation" online to be illegal. I find this ridiculous considering the massive challenge we have ahead of us just to get the vaccine to the millions of people who desper…

I'm not sure I agree. The maths says that we need about 70% of the population to take the vaccine in order for it to no longer be a threat. We also have polling that says about 53% will refuse to take the vaccine. So we're already at the point where something else must be done such as adding incentives, a passport system or better advertising etc. OR continued lockdown measures and enforcement of mask wearing. It's n…

> The maths says that we need about 70% of the population to take the vaccine in order for it to no longer be a threat

...to no longer be a threat to an unvaccinated person.

This isn't like the childhood vaccines, where we need herd immunity to protect the children who are too young to be vaccinated.

Provided that everyone who wants the vaccine can get it, I don't see the problem with letting everyone else make their own decision.

The current priority list of people is nowhere near 70% of the population anyway. Most people under 50 won't have the opportunity to be vaccinated for months. So this absolutely is a theoretical problem, at least for now.

Given that Covid is such a mild disease for most young people, I predict that by the time the elderly and vulnerable have been vaccinated, this will be a non-issue anyway.

Re: Pfizer Covid vaccine approved for use next week in UK

#315

Post by free2OSS » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 2:34 PM UTC

jfoster wrote: post #236

shusson wrote: post #71

Out of curiosity, how do people on HN rate the risk of long term side-effects?

I'm concerned about that, but I'm far more concerned about covid-19, so I would be pretty happy to take a vaccine. Covid is known to have risk of death, side-effects, and unknown future medical conditions, so it seems unlikely that a vaccine would be much worse than that.

Nearly all of the things you mentioned is among old or obese people.

Lucky children can't vote, lets start vaccinations!

I somewhat kid, but COVID is a real life example where a tiny minority has ruled over the overwhelming majority.

Re: Pfizer Covid vaccine approved for use next week in UK

#316

Post by refurb » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 2:35 PM UTC

amrangaye wrote: post #280

Wintamute wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you're missing is that amongst a certain class of Brit, and across much of the West, relentless and savage cultural self-criticism has become the norm, and a currency used for in-group signalling. Even when people in the UK should be celebrating, as literally the first country in the world to develop an approved C19 vaccine in record breaking time, and enjoy the privilege of a free health system that can roll it…

Completely agree. Same thing happens in the US - to hear some Americans speak they have become a dictatorship with a tyrant in charge, and the whole system is broken. Meanwhile they continue to have free and fair elections, first amendment rights, the ability to take their government to court etc. In my country (in west africa) just voting against the dictator in charge can get you banned from getting any employment,…

Seriously. I encourage anyone who thinks the US or any other Western country is a dictatorship to move to a developing nation and give it a try. I have.

Once you've interacted with a corrupt bureaucracy or wondered whether the medicine you bought is counterfeit or realized the only thing stopping the cops from shaking you down is luck, you get a new found appreciation for stability, reliability and fairness (yes not always) of developed countries.

Re: Pfizer Covid vaccine approved for use next week in UK

#317

Post by buzzerbetrayed » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 2:35 PM UTC

tgb wrote: post #307

shusson wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I just don't think an opinion poll on a tech board is going to yield an accurate prediction of what to expect. Part of your answer, which I'm paraphrasing to "I don't know, talk to the experts", is already a good answer. But I was hoping that there was an expert lurking around that might be able to explain the risks or link to some evidence.

You asked what "people on HN" think which is not exactly the top way to fish out experts.

If an expert read that, they would likely respond, citing why they are an expert. So I think it’s as good a way as any on hn.

Re: Pfizer Covid vaccine approved for use next week in UK

#318

Post by djmobley » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 2:35 PM UTC

afandian wrote: post #98

jakozaur wrote: post #19

In terms of rollout. UK is the ideal country to be the first: 1. Heavily impacted by Covid-19. 2. Centralised health care system makes it easier to compare results and efficiency. E.g. it's UK which figured out that dexamethasone is efficient against Covid https://www.who.int/news/item/16-06-2020-who-welcomes-prelim... 3. Developed country with great logistics.

To your point 3, Belgium may well have great logistics but the UK government has knowingly undermined and compromised UK logistics (the whole industry is crying out) as part of their Brexit process. Maybe there are extraordinary arrangements being made for the vaccine, but it won't be because of a good prevailing open-market logistics situation. Edit: here's the Road Haulage Association warning of severe supply chain…

Your comment has nothing to do with the logistics of rolling out a mass vaccination programme, but how exactly have the UK government’s Brexit negotiations “undermined and compromised UK logistics”?

Negotiations are ongoing to secure a trade deal with the EU once the transition period is over. The UK are also securing trade deals with other countries, including Canada and Japan.

Both sides recognise failure to reach a deal, or to extend the transition period, would be damaging for both sides.

Which is precisely why both sides are negotiating a deal to ensure that doesn’t happen...

Am I missing something here?

Re: Pfizer Covid vaccine approved for use next week in UK

#319

Post by jansan » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 2:36 PM UTC

dbbk wrote: post #239

gr2zr4 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We all are still waiting peer-reviewd scientific papers instead of press releases....

Sorry, do you think the UK regulator approved Pfizer based on... a press release?

They certainly did not approve it on a study about long term effects of the vaccine.

Re: Pfizer Covid vaccine approved for use next week in UK

#320

Post by eplanit » Wed, Dec 02, 2020, 2:36 PM UTC

jakozaur wrote: post #19

In terms of rollout. UK is the ideal country to be the first: 1. Heavily impacted by Covid-19. 2. Centralised health care system makes it easier to compare results and efficiency. E.g. it's UK which figured out that dexamethasone is efficient against Covid https://www.who.int/news/item/16-06-2020-who-welcomes-prelim... 3. Developed country with great logistics.

[flagged]