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McKinsey Proposed Paying Pharmacy Companies Rebates for OxyContin Overdoses

nytimes.com

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Re: McKinsey Proposed Paying Pharmacy Companies Rebates for OxyContin Overdoses

#41

Post by jakelazaroff »

zug_zug wrote: post #37
jakelazaroff wrote: post #16

It's absolutely infuriating that no one is being prosecuted over this. Meanwhile, Kalief Browder was jailed without trial for three years — for allegedly stealing a backpack. We truly do have two justice systems.

I think it's pretty easy to act outraged and say "somebody should be punished," and most people I know, and most politicians, do. As for actually doing research, thinking about it, and bothering up to come up with a proposal... I guess nobody actually cares THAT much.

You say "doing research, thinking about it, and bothering to come up with a proposal" as if the only obstacle is that no one has figured out how to bring these people to justice.

That's not what's happening here. These are people who use their immense power and resources to warp our bureaucracy to protect and enrich themselves. They don't face real consequences because the system is designed to shield them from accountability.

Re: McKinsey Proposed Paying Pharmacy Companies Rebates for OxyContin Overdoses

#42

Post by sksnskkcahan »

curiousllama wrote: post #7
AmericanChopper wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you’re cynical enough, you could easily argue that every relationship that any person has is based on nothing more than resources. Somebody claims to love their wife? Unlikely. They’re just looking for some love and fulfilment resource. Do you really like your friends? Or do you just like the way friendship makes you feel?

Only if you define resource so broadly as to constitute anything, at which point the statement becomes “all relationships are based on things” ... which, like, yes of course

You’re right, and I think this is a good point against the root comment. Nobody can argue against the claim that we are all just resources to politicians, corporations, and law enforcement because it is vacuously true. It’s like saying we are all just atoms. It doesn’t tell us whether many or most in those industries are good people who are in it for the right reasons. And of course, this story about a particular repugnant act can’t prove such a blanket statement.

Re: McKinsey Proposed Paying Pharmacy Companies Rebates for OxyContin Overdoses

#43

Post by AmericanChopper »

sudosysgen wrote: post #28
AmericanChopper wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you’re cynical enough, you could easily argue that every relationship that any person has is based on nothing more than resources. Somebody claims to love their wife? Unlikely. They’re just looking for some love and fulfilment resource. Do you really like your friends? Or do you just like the way friendship makes you feel?

You've redefined resource to be literally anything, in an attempt of coming to a materialist worldview. There's three important attributes of resources. Firstly, resources of a same type, defined by their use, are fungible. Secondly, resources are a means to an end. Lastly, resources are valuable either because of their uses or because they can be exchanged. Now, love, fulfillment, and the feeling of friendship reali…

There are many abstract concepts included in the definition of the word resources. You’re trying to argue that it means computable wealth and absolutely nothing else. Which is very obviously ridiculous, and it’s hard to see this comment as anything other than an attempt to start some pointless semantic debate.

Re: McKinsey Proposed Paying Pharmacy Companies Rebates for OxyContin Overdoses

#44

Post by CGamesPlay »

spanktheuser wrote: post #26

Moral absolutism has been out of vogue for 50 years, but I encourage everyone to give it a spin. It’s provides such wonderful moral clarity and said clarity is surprisingly effective at rooting out the sort of poisonous people who ruin friendships, companies and societies. I’ve dealt with numerous McKinsey consultants over a 30 year career. I’ve collected enough data points to feel safe in concluding the following: •…

> I encourage everyone to give [Moral absolutism] a spin

> state that they performed terribly regardless of what occurred... [report] that their interview behavior during the interview seemed erratic, to the extent that I questioned their sobriety

Quite some cognitive dissonance you're holding onto there!

Re: McKinsey Proposed Paying Pharmacy Companies Rebates for OxyContin Overdoses

#45

Post by marcinzm »

zug_zug wrote: post #37
jakelazaroff wrote: post #16

It's absolutely infuriating that no one is being prosecuted over this. Meanwhile, Kalief Browder was jailed without trial for three years — for allegedly stealing a backpack. We truly do have two justice systems.

I think it's pretty easy to act outraged and say "somebody should be punished," and most people I know, and most politicians, do. As for actually doing research, thinking about it, and bothering up to come up with a proposal... I guess nobody actually cares THAT much.

A justice system that applies equally to everyone should not require immense effort from private unrelated individuals to do it's job.

Re: McKinsey Proposed Paying Pharmacy Companies Rebates for OxyContin Overdoses

#46

Post by bleepblorp »

zug_zug wrote: post #37
jakelazaroff wrote: post #16

It's absolutely infuriating that no one is being prosecuted over this. Meanwhile, Kalief Browder was jailed without trial for three years — for allegedly stealing a backpack. We truly do have two justice systems.

I think it's pretty easy to act outraged and say "somebody should be punished," and most people I know, and most politicians, do. As for actually doing research, thinking about it, and bothering up to come up with a proposal... I guess nobody actually cares THAT much.

What sort of 'proposal' do you suggest to deter unethical business practices and encourage the prosecution of white collar crime under existing laws?

The problem with white collar crime isn't a lack of ideas, it's a lack of will among prosecutors and judges to punish it.

Re: McKinsey Proposed Paying Pharmacy Companies Rebates for OxyContin Overdoses

#47

Post by Spooky23 »

spanktheuser wrote: post #26

Moral absolutism has been out of vogue for 50 years, but I encourage everyone to give it a spin. It’s provides such wonderful moral clarity and said clarity is surprisingly effective at rooting out the sort of poisonous people who ruin friendships, companies and societies. I’ve dealt with numerous McKinsey consultants over a 30 year career. I’ve collected enough data points to feel safe in concluding the following: •…

They are no more evil than any other business. We live in an era where a certain philosophy has taken root, and government is much weaker than in the past.

Re: McKinsey Proposed Paying Pharmacy Companies Rebates for OxyContin Overdoses

#48

Post by spanktheuser »

xoxoy wrote: post #32
Spooky23 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CVS can choose to set metrics and implement systems to discourage noticing that one person is pulling multiple scripts, for example. Also remember that CVS is basically a monopoly wholesaler as well as a retailer — so they can play games at that level as well like stuffing the channel to favor the manufacturer that pays them more on the backend. Railroad trusts and standard oil did the same thing in the 1900s. This i…

yeah I guess the wording of the story is confusing. I think it’s less “here’s a reward for literally killing people” and more “here’s a little something to soften the blow of an OD so that you continue to fill Oxycotin without judgement or heavy restrictions”

I love your phrasing... “soften the blow.”

I’m trying to imagine this 45 year old CVS VP of Product stuffing the channel with opiates & hiding the analytics on one hand. And on the other hand feeling real bad somebody somewhere ODed.

These emotions - they belong to two very different people. Who don’t like each other at all.

Re: McKinsey Proposed Paying Pharmacy Companies Rebates for OxyContin Overdoses

#49

Post by troughway »

spanktheuser wrote: post #26

Moral absolutism has been out of vogue for 50 years, but I encourage everyone to give it a spin. It’s provides such wonderful moral clarity and said clarity is surprisingly effective at rooting out the sort of poisonous people who ruin friendships, companies and societies. I’ve dealt with numerous McKinsey consultants over a 30 year career. I’ve collected enough data points to feel safe in concluding the following: •…

While I would love to endorse these comments they come across as pretentious posturing, no more than a 4chan LARP session.

None of what you just said is going to happen.

Re: McKinsey Proposed Paying Pharmacy Companies Rebates for OxyContin Overdoses

#50

Post by zug_zug »

jakelazaroff wrote: post #41
zug_zug wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's pretty easy to act outraged and say "somebody should be punished," and most people I know, and most politicians, do. As for actually doing research, thinking about it, and bothering up to come up with a proposal... I guess nobody actually cares THAT much.

You say "doing research, thinking about it, and bothering to come up with a proposal" as if the only obstacle is that no one has figured out how to bring these people to justice. That's not what's happening here. These are people who use their immense power and resources to warp our bureaucracy to protect and enrich themselves. They don't face real consequences because the system is designed to shield them from accou…

>>> They don't face real consequences

Who's they?

It's so easy to hand-wave about "them" and "the system," but I don't see how you're helping people unless you're helping to make concrete proposals or helping to identify specific policies by specific people that need to be punished and/or prevented in the future.

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