I’m going to date how old I am. I remember when LeMond was the spokesperson for Taco Bell at the height of his career. It’s weird hearing his name again and that memory being triggered in me.
Greg LeMond’s New 26 LB. Carbon Fiber Ebike
121–130 of 308 posts
Re: Greg LeMond’s New 26 LB. Carbon Fiber Ebike
#122Coming from conventional bikes, I don't understand who this is for. Carbon fibre frames are prohibitively expensive and the market for them serves very involved, often professional or semi-pro cyclists whose performance bottlenecks are imposed by the bike instead of themselves. Ditto for some of the other details on the bike, like the medium-dish carbon rims — all for the sake of weight savings and aerodynamics (sinc…
It feels like you are not really following the trends in bike designs. Carbon frames are really common now, and are available in mid-range road, mountain or gravel bikes. You can even order one on AliExpress for cheap and build a decent road bike around it. And it’s not only the weight that carbon frame bike owners are after - the material gives much better ride quality than aluminium. Deep rims are nothing spectacul…
I mean no offense, but many of the advantages that you've cited are more of claimed advantages from the marketing departments of big manufacturer rather than proven advantages that the tech gives you. The author of the comment to which you replied does seem to understand the trends in bike designs these days and feels that these trends do not fit well into the market segment of e-bikes. I agree.
> it’s not only the weight that carbon frame bike owners are after - the material gives much better ride quality than aluminium.
The affect the frame has on the ride quality is significantly smaller than other components of the ride like the tires and seat post[0]. Carbon often has a very small weight improvement over a well made steel or aluminum bikes, so if you're buying an e-bike because you want pedal assist, I don't understand the need to shave 1 or 2 pounds off the bike.
> Deep rims are nothing spectacular either, their weight penalty is nicely offset by aero gain.
This appears to be true. Most of the aero penalty of the bike comes from the wheels and having deeper wheels does reduce the drag a lot.
> One chainring is all the rage in bikes now
It is all the rage, but it's not clear yet whether it's justified or just a ploy by the manufacturers to save costs on their end. The gear ratio of this bike goes from 1.0 on the low end to only 3.64. 1.0 is pretty good for going up hills, especially with the motor assist, but 3.64 is really low, especially for a bike trying to tout itself as really fast! I don't understand this choice. Most road bikes have a top end ratio of around 4.54.
> Mudguards and simple handlebars make this bike utilitarian and well-suited to commuting
The mudguards are nice, but I don't understand the choice of handlebars. Why do you want a super aero light-weight bike but then put flat handlebars on it so you can't get in an aero position like you can with drop handlebars. This doesn't make sense. Furthermore, the bike doesn't have mounting points for a front or rear rack, which is a huge downside for commuting, if not a dealbreaker.
[0] https://www.cyclingabout.com/why-impossible-steel-frames-mor...
[edit] you're right that trends do matter when affecting people's purchasing decision since most people aren't very informed about the actual pros/cons of the tech they're buying, but this doesn't undermine the original commenter's opinion that this bike doesn't make sense from a technical standpoint.
Re: Greg LeMond’s New 26 LB. Carbon Fiber Ebike
#123Earlier quoted context omitted.
1x is a cost reduction measure disguised as a "new thing". Same price - less components = more profit.
I very much doubt that's true, as evidenced by cheaper bikes still sporting 3x chainrings. 1x is entirely about removing the front derailleur and all its associated complication. It's especially common in mountain bikes because they experience a lot more opportunity to break.
That's what the bike industry wants people to believe so they have motivation to buy upgrades. 3x cranks weren't dropping like flies for 99.9% of users.
Their MO is to always come up with what's going to be the latest new thing then use the media outlets to pump their idea to boost sales. Same thing is happening with the forced imposition of disc brakes on road bikes. Then it's going to be hookless rims that can only handle 75 psi max.
Re: Greg LeMond’s New 26 LB. Carbon Fiber Ebike
#124Coming from conventional bikes, I don't understand who this is for. Carbon fibre frames are prohibitively expensive and the market for them serves very involved, often professional or semi-pro cyclists whose performance bottlenecks are imposed by the bike instead of themselves. Ditto for some of the other details on the bike, like the medium-dish carbon rims — all for the sake of weight savings and aerodynamics (sinc…
I agree with the overall sentiment — who is this for? — but: > carbon fibre frames are prohibitively expensive and the market for them serves very involved, often professional or semi-pro cyclists whose performance bottlenecks are imposed by the bike instead of themselves. just isn't true. Many hobbyist/amateur/weekend warrior-type cyclist ride carbon bikes. They can be had at lowish prices (my first was £1000) to mu…
> A double chainring setup likely offers smaller gaps between gears but likely a comparable overall range from lowest to highest.
This isn't true. This bike is using a 40 gear crank in the front with an 11-40 cassette in the back. That puts the gear ratio at 1.0 on the low end and 3.64 on the high end. The corresponding Shimano GRX setup with a double chainring would be a 46-30 in the front and a 11-34 in the back. This gives a 0.88 ratio on the low end and 4.18 on the high end, which is actually quite a big difference. One could argue that the difference in gear ratio on the low end isn't a big deal because this bike has pedal assist, but the difference on the high end is quite noticeable.
Re: Greg LeMond’s New 26 LB. Carbon Fiber Ebike
#125Earlier quoted context omitted.
It feels like you are not really following the trends in bike designs. Carbon frames are really common now, and are available in mid-range road, mountain or gravel bikes. You can even order one on AliExpress for cheap and build a decent road bike around it. And it’s not only the weight that carbon frame bike owners are after - the material gives much better ride quality than aluminium. Deep rims are nothing spectacul…
I mean no offense, but many of the advantages that you've cited are more of claimed advantages from the marketing departments of big manufacturer rather than proven advantages that the tech gives you. The author of the comment to which you replied does seem to understand the trends in bike designs these days and feels that these trends do not fit well into the market segment of e-bikes. I agree. > it’s not only the w…
I agree with most of your points, especially that the demand is strongly influenced by marketing/fashion and percieved values of the product, not objective ones.
Diving deeper into gears and handlebars - I believe it’s a very consious choice.
- max speed with an optimal cadence (90 rpm) in this setup seems to be around 43km/h. This is plenty fast and definetely above typical commuting speeds. Even the electric support is more about better range/less sweat than making the bike fast, speeds appproaching 50km/h are close to the legal limits anyway
- with straight handlebars it’s comfortable to ride, no matter the level of personal fitness. Drop bars make you bend more - this isn’t very inviting and could drive off the customers that are accustomed to relaxed positions (that they know from riding in their SUVs daily). And with speeds mostly well below 40km/h there is no need to curl into the aero postion. Just put on some trendy glasses and the electric support will deal with the extra drag.
It really goes hand in hand and I’d be suprised if such bike would be released in other config.
Re: Greg LeMond’s New 26 LB. Carbon Fiber Ebike
#126Earlier quoted context omitted.
> whose performance bottlenecks are imposed by the bike instead of themselves I'm a fluid dynamics researcher, and I'll tell you the money these people spend on "aero" and "weight saving" and "higher drivetrain efficiency" stuff is 99.9% snake oil. Unless you are among the top 1000 road bike racers in the world. Increasing your exercise load by half an hour per week, or spending a little time understanding and implem…
>spending a little time understanding and implementing aerodynamically efficient body posture You might be interested in what we're up to [0], get in touch if it interests you. [0] https://bodyrocket.cc
I don't understand why you need to measure anything but instantaneous crank torque, speed, and (for completeness) pitch angle. Integrating power in vs acceleration out, the difference is loss. What am I missing? Does bad posture waste energy before it reaches the crank?
Re: Greg LeMond’s New 26 LB. Carbon Fiber Ebike
#127Earlier quoted context omitted.
I agree with the overall sentiment — who is this for? — but: > carbon fibre frames are prohibitively expensive and the market for them serves very involved, often professional or semi-pro cyclists whose performance bottlenecks are imposed by the bike instead of themselves. just isn't true. Many hobbyist/amateur/weekend warrior-type cyclist ride carbon bikes. They can be had at lowish prices (my first was £1000) to mu…
> A double chainring setup likely offers smaller gaps between gears but likely a comparable overall range from lowest to highest. This isn't true. This bike is using a 40 gear crank in the front with an 11-40 cassette in the back. That puts the gear ratio at 1.0 on the low end and 3.64 on the high end. The corresponding Shimano GRX setup with a double chainring would be a 46-30 in the front and a 11-34 in the back. T…
Only if you're in a hurry.
Re: Greg LeMond’s New 26 LB. Carbon Fiber Ebike
#128Coming from conventional bikes, I don't understand who this is for. Carbon fibre frames are prohibitively expensive and the market for them serves very involved, often professional or semi-pro cyclists whose performance bottlenecks are imposed by the bike instead of themselves. Ditto for some of the other details on the bike, like the medium-dish carbon rims — all for the sake of weight savings and aerodynamics (sinc…
> whose performance bottlenecks are imposed by the bike instead of themselves I'm a fluid dynamics researcher, and I'll tell you the money these people spend on "aero" and "weight saving" and "higher drivetrain efficiency" stuff is 99.9% snake oil. Unless you are among the top 1000 road bike racers in the world. Increasing your exercise load by half an hour per week, or spending a little time understanding and implem…
My understanding is that weight saved on anything that rotates has an even bigger impact, but that doesn't change what you've said. The vast majority of posers bragging about the 500 grams they've saved in parts are carrying an extra 10 pounds on their own frame.
Re: Greg LeMond’s New 26 LB. Carbon Fiber Ebike
#129Earlier quoted context omitted.
> whose performance bottlenecks are imposed by the bike instead of themselves I'm a fluid dynamics researcher, and I'll tell you the money these people spend on "aero" and "weight saving" and "higher drivetrain efficiency" stuff is 99.9% snake oil. Unless you are among the top 1000 road bike racers in the world. Increasing your exercise load by half an hour per week, or spending a little time understanding and implem…
My understanding is that weight saved on anything that rotates has an even bigger impact, but that doesn't change what you've said. The vast majority of posers bragging about the 500 grams they've saved in parts are carrying an extra 10 pounds on their own frame.
the rotating weight thing is mostly myth, while true that rotating mass costs more to accelerate, cyclists don’t accelerate hard enough for it to amount to anything substantive. source: i did the math in excel
Re: Greg LeMond’s New 26 LB. Carbon Fiber Ebike
#130Coming from conventional bikes, I don't understand who this is for. Carbon fibre frames are prohibitively expensive and the market for them serves very involved, often professional or semi-pro cyclists whose performance bottlenecks are imposed by the bike instead of themselves. Ditto for some of the other details on the bike, like the medium-dish carbon rims — all for the sake of weight savings and aerodynamics (sinc…
> whose performance bottlenecks are imposed by the bike instead of themselves I'm a fluid dynamics researcher, and I'll tell you the money these people spend on "aero" and "weight saving" and "higher drivetrain efficiency" stuff is 99.9% snake oil. Unless you are among the top 1000 road bike racers in the world. Increasing your exercise load by half an hour per week, or spending a little time understanding and implem…
aero changes can be quite substantive even for amateurs. on the order of a minute or so per 40k tt
aero equipment and position and training are all orthogonal so it isn’t a question of picking just one.