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Switzerland – Europe's Silicon Valley for Developers?

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Re: Switzerland – Europe's Silicon Valley for Developers?

#21

Post by 8ytecoder »

somedude895 wrote: post #13
aphroz wrote: post #3

Not at all. Yes Switzerland is probably the best country if you want to follow the rules, have a good quality of life and good education for your children. Not much for developers who are looking for interesting challenges. This is due to the mentality of the population and the risk aversion of the investors. From a Swiss person.

I tend to agree. Apparently it's very hard to get funding for novel ideas in Switzerland. And yes, risk aversion is a big part of Swiss culture, an example of which being that Swiss are some of the most over-insured people, and savings rates also regularly top the charts. A fairly egalitarian society with a high standard of living makes for a people that doesn't like or "have to" take risks

If you have a lot to lose... My biggest change was the lose of appetite for risk when I moved to a first world country. When you have a comfortable life it’s hard to kick out of it.

Re: Switzerland – Europe's Silicon Valley for Developers?

#22

Post by gumby »

> In 2019 Switzerland attracted $ 445 million of investments.

With twice the population of Silicon Valley this alone points to "no". If you add SF and the rest of the Bay Area, the populations become much closer, but the investment ratio is far worse.

Of course the economy here has become rather lopsided over the past 20 years while Switzerland's economy is more diverse. (e.g. I don't think I've drunk local milk since the dairy in downtown Palo Alto closed.)

Re: Switzerland – Europe's Silicon Valley for Developers?

#23

Post by est31 »

ThePhysicist wrote: post #15
atemerev wrote: post #7

Sadly, no. The bureaucracy of opening and running a business here is staggering (and the minimum starting capital for opening an analog of LLC is more than $20,000, and more than $100,000 for a corporation). Perhaps you have heard that there are few taxes in Switzerland; this is not true (and also a lot of obligatory social security payments for the each employee which are almost impossible to manage without a dedica…

Starting a GmbH theoretically requires 25.000 € in Germany, but you only have to pay in half of that in the beginning. I think in Switzerland it's similar? If you don't want to invest 5-10 T€ to start a company you can look into Estland's eResidency programme, which enables you to start a limited liability company there, giving you access to the EEA market as well.

Since a few years you can start a GmbH for 1 €, but in the case of hitting Germany's chapter 11 analog (Insolvenzverfahren) you have to pay up to those 25k€ until limited liability kicks in.

Re: Switzerland – Europe's Silicon Valley for Developers?

#25

Post by skratlo »

mkl95 wrote: post #18

Trust me, there is no such thing as a European Silicon Valley, and there won't be one any time soon.

I hope there won't be one, at the end, what good really came out of Silicon Valley anyway? The good parts can be equated to any other place where innovation takes place, be it in Europe or elsewhere. The rest is tons of crap and speculation.

Re: Switzerland – Europe's Silicon Valley for Developers?

#26

Post by lukeqsee »

As an American immigrant to Switzerland, don’t move here to be on the cutting technical edge. You will be sorely disappointed. It’s a function of societal mentality (slow to change as a way of ensuring enduring stability) and size (fewer people, fairly spread out, only two or three cities big enough to be tech hubs).

I moved here for a lot of other reasons, and I’m very happy with my decision and its benefits, but a startup cutting edge country, it is not. If you want that, try Estonia!

Re: Switzerland – Europe's Silicon Valley for Developers?

#27

Post by bluetomcat »

Abishek_Muthian wrote: post #4
aphroz wrote: post #3

Not at all. Yes Switzerland is probably the best country if you want to follow the rules, have a good quality of life and good education for your children. Not much for developers who are looking for interesting challenges. This is due to the mentality of the population and the risk aversion of the investors. From a Swiss person.

>This is due to the mentality of the population and the risk aversion of the investors Can you please expand on those two points?

Swiss culture is all about safety, confidentiality and responsible spending of already earned money. Additionally, the prevailing business model is that of the Mittelstand small-to-medium enterprise. Small factories spread throughout the whole country, highly specialized in one thing (producing mostly bits of industrial equipment), co-dependent on other such companies to form the economic blood system of the country. A fascinatingly-organized society, nevertheless. From a Bulgarian who has been there for 1 year.

Re: Switzerland – Europe's Silicon Valley for Developers?

#28

Post by gblaickzou »

johncena33 wrote: post #17
dblock wrote: post #6

I’m Swiss, did CS at the University of Geneva and work at AWS in New York. “The lake is not burning” is my favorite way to describe Switzerland when it comes to software and startups. And everything else, in fact.

> The lake is not burning I am non-native, but fluent English speaker. Can you please explain what does this phrase mean?

Water is wet is my guess

Re: Switzerland – Europe's Silicon Valley for Developers?

#29

Post by jcfrei »

atemerev wrote: post #16
jcfrei wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are very interesting software companies in Switzerland. And those companies are taking a lot of risks as well. Maybe your impression stems from the fact that it's not a very visible ecosystem and the funding is obviously much smaller than in bigger economies.

These companies were not financed by venture capital (except for some cryptocurrency companies, which are popular here indeed). Also, some of the software companies were moved here for tax reasons, but they were founded elsewhere.

Don't know why you are talking in absolutes here. There's quite a bit of venture funding outside of the cryptocurrency space. Crunchbase shows $2B total in funding for Zurich alone (https://www.crunchbase.com/hub/zurich-startups) - don't know how that compares internationally but it's definitely something rather than nothing.
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