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How to Think for Yourself

paulgraham.com

331–340 of 874 posts

Re: How to Think for Yourself

#331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How do you get out of flat-earth on your own, without re-living centuries of astronomic research? How do you get out of moonlanding negationism, without personally examining all the retrieved moon rocks? How do you get out of antivaxxing, without personally living through pestilence? (well, at least Covid19 should help with that...) Find a way to get rationalists out of believing that these examples are an accurate…

I think you misunderstand the purpose of these examples. They're not meant to be typical representations; they're meant to be non-controversial representations, allowing us to discuss the thought processes involved without having the conversation derailed by people who honestly believe the example.

Perhaps. If, for the sake of argument, we accept that as true...might it be also true that they are other things, simultaneously?

Who knows what ideas (and communications of ideas) really are, how they really work, what influence they exert on the very fabric of the environment (this infinitely complex, magical soup that we refer to as reality) in which they (and we) are contained, and what the infinite, recursive downstream consequences are of this influence.

At the end of the day, they "are what they are" and "do what they do", and the same applies to their (unseen, unrealized, misunderstood) systemic consequences. We can culturally deny such things (just as conspiracy theory culture collectively denies many things) all we want, but this does not stop it from being actually true. Mother Nature does not require our agreement when organizing the structure and affairs of the universe, but we may mind a great deal when the system she has designed (that we rarely try to truly understand) serves up the consequences of any wilful ignorance that we may be guilty of (see: Planet Earth, 2020).

An extremely large number of people confidently (and sincerely) make claims that seem to suggest they have a deep, accurate understanding of all this complexity. My intuition suggests that these people may not actually be as correct as they perceive themselves to be.

>> Find a way to get rationalists out of believing that these examples are an accurate representation of the beliefs of the conspiracy world in general, and you may be well on your way to a universal solution.

This is but one instance of a much larger problem. But solve this one, and you may have unknowingly solved many others.

FTA:

You can also take more explicit measures to prevent yourself from automatically adopting conventional opinions. The most general is to cultivate an attitude of skepticism. When you hear someone say something, stop and ask yourself "Is that true?" Don't say it out loud. I'm not suggesting that you impose on everyone who talks to you the burden of proving what they say, but rather that you take upon yourself the burden of evaluating what they say.

"Saying things out loud" certainly has consequences (which come in many forms....loss of friends, ostracization, downvotes, etc). I wonder...might there also be some downstream systemic consequences to not "saying things out loud"...like for example when some of the things that are not said out loud are ~unpopular/unpleasant to ponder, but also true and extremely important.

Re: How to Think for Yourself

#333
post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disagree. This sounds a bit harsh, nitpicking at one instance of a class. Go back and read all his essays. You'll learn more than if you got your MBA. (I know. I've done both.) Believe me, I'm not PG fan boy, but he doesn't have to do this and I hope he never stops.

I don't have an MBA but I think you're vastly overestimating the information density of these essays. Or maybe MBAs are really just that vacuous, I don't know. PG has wrote some really great essays (the Submarine Article, anyone?). I've read all of them, some of them many times. But if I'm being completely honest, lately it feels like he's writing to write instead of writing because he has something genuinely new and…

Somewhat more charitably, I think he’s writing about very basic things, which a different skill than writing about new and exciting things. Such essays are more useful to some people than others.

Re: How to Think for Yourself

#334
post #256

> There are some kinds of work that you can't do well without thinking differently from your peers. To be a successful scientist, for example, it's not enough just to be correct. Your ideas have to be both correct and novel. As someone who once made their living as a scientist, I can tell you from firsthand experience that while this is technically correct, the conclusion PG wishes to draw from this: > One of the mos…

I think this may attest to the value of (apparent) novelty/innovation in PG's sphere. Seeming unconventional and disruptive has better ROI than spending years mining the history of human thought. He doesn't do science, he funds and markets products. He's competing to capture pieces of a finite pie, not creating knowledge. More broadly, he promotes a zeitgeist which has made him wealthy. I wonder if this has something…

[deleted]

Re: How to Think for Yourself

#335
Conventional-minded people don't like to think of themselves as conventional-minded. And in any case, it genuinely feels to them as if they make up their own minds about everything. It's just a coincidence that their beliefs are identical to their peers'.

I'm not sure about this. I think people are aware of what is conventional, and that's why they gravitate towards it. It's a risk-mitigation strategy, or in the case of curiosity, the explore-exploit trade-off at work.

Life presents you with a bewildering array of options. It greatly helps to establish what the conventional choice is. It will generally be the safe option, a path well-trodden. You can try to reverse-engineer why it became the conventional choice, gain an appreciation of its advantages, maybe tweak things to find a slightly more optimal solution for your personal circumstance... but sticking with convention qua convention is generally justified. People don't 'accidentally' make the same choices as most others, they deliberately identify what is conventional and follow that path. Go to university, buy a house with a mortgage, get a car on PCP, marry before having children, etc etc

Likewise for a small child there is no downside to curiosity, only upside. As an adult, there is an awareness that you need to earn your daily bread, before all else. Working with people who seem to just follow flights of fancy, risking their livelihood, can be infuriating.

And then there is the whole meta-question of conventional thoughts versus conventional statements. If you believe something that is widely disbelieved, and you speak up, you're sticking your neck out. When I see people do this I tend to get the impression they have not really calibrated their bet on being right against the reputational risk they are assuming.

Re: How to Think for Yourself

#336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this may attest to the value of (apparent) novelty/innovation in PG's sphere. Seeming unconventional and disruptive has better ROI than spending years mining the history of human thought. He doesn't do science, he funds and markets products. He's competing to capture pieces of a finite pie, not creating knowledge. More broadly, he promotes a zeitgeist which has made him wealthy. I wonder if this has something…

Sorry but I strongly disagree with your assertion that building a business is a zero-sum game. At the basic level, a farmer who sows a field and harvests a crop is making the world one harvest richer, and no one poorer. Ditto for the carpenter making a table or mechanic fixing a car. PG addressed this long ago: http://paulgraham.com/gap.html Scientists turn money into knowledge. Entrepreneurs turn knowledge into mone…

> Sorry but I strongly disagree with your assertion that building a business is a zero-sum game.

It isn't either/or. Nearly all businesses do "create value". Nearly all businesses also compete for a limited supply of customers, because nearly all markets can produce more outputs than are needed.

The ratio between the two matters a lot to the character of the company.

Re: How to Think for Yourself

#337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He's competing to capture pieces of a finite pie this is an odd way to describe investing. this would more accurately describe the founders themselves, competing for a finite pool of VC dollars without necessarily having a viable product.

Good point. I meant it in the sense that anyone marketing a product is competing for a finite pool of consumer dollars.

FWIW, I agree with the rest of your post. while I enjoy some of PG's posts, he often makes the classic mistake of presuming that expertise in one specific area makes his opinion on other topics relevant.

Re: How to Think for Yourself

#338
post #256

> There are some kinds of work that you can't do well without thinking differently from your peers. To be a successful scientist, for example, it's not enough just to be correct. Your ideas have to be both correct and novel. As someone who once made their living as a scientist, I can tell you from firsthand experience that while this is technically correct, the conclusion PG wishes to draw from this: > One of the mos…

> Being skeptical of the conventional wisdom can be useful, but keeping yourself intentionally ignorant of it is generally a bad plan. I can vouch for that. I write software, but my original training was as an EE. My software development methodology was almost entirely self-taught. This has been both good and bad. I will sometimes come up with some really interesting orthogonal approaches, but I will also sometimes "…

I think ordering of exposure makes a difference. Being submersed in prior art and then trying to come up with something novel is much harder or less likely than having conviction around a novel idea/experience and then digging into prior art to strengthen your offering.

Re: How to Think for Yourself

#339

> To be a successful scientist, for example, it's not enough just to be correct. Your ideas have to be both correct and novel. You can't publish papers saying things other people already know. To be a brilliant scientist - maybe. To be a successful scientist - I think (unfortunately) the opposite. If you rock the boat too hard - by challenging or contradicting other scientists' work, then you'll be gently rebuffed on…

Yeah, I mean a LOT of people - scientists, software developers, etc - already struggle to do things correctly, let alone in a novel way. There's huge value in work that is not groundbreaking. For the sciences for example: Repeat or (re) confirm someone else's theories. Repeatability is one of the most important parts of science, and if all the scientists only pushed to do something new, instead of double-checking oth…

I would add that shallow understanding of this essay is also toxic.

Two weeks ago on some forum for developers I have seen a guy that was basically refusing to learn what other people did because he was convinced that he should be "inventing new unseen algorithms".

That was an IT undergrad that was bored with learning about things other people already invented. He just could not understand that in order to invent something new and groundbreaking you have to learn quite a lot of what already was there. Otherwise you will invent something that someone in 1820 came up with and think that you are genius.

So I agree with PG that there is a lot of value in independent thinking, but one has to be smart enough to realize where to stop. Essay is also not saying "non novel thinking is useless", because it is really useful.

Re: How to Think for Yourself

#340
post #256

> There are some kinds of work that you can't do well without thinking differently from your peers. To be a successful scientist, for example, it's not enough just to be correct. Your ideas have to be both correct and novel. As someone who once made their living as a scientist, I can tell you from firsthand experience that while this is technically correct, the conclusion PG wishes to draw from this: > One of the mos…

And, like most kinds of work these days, science progress is mainly collaborative, rather than the result of one independent thinker.

pg seems predisposed to dichotomous thinking. This could be about his rhetorical style. It's easier to write an essay, or a screenplay, with good guys and bad guys. The world is more like a novel now, with multiple independent processes in shades of gray.

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