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Doctors and Nurses Are Running on Empty

nytimes.com

81–90 of 180 posts

Re: Doctors and Nurses Are Running on Empty

#81
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah it's sad people feel pains. I'm also unhappy that those same people have used Regulatory capture to increase their wages at the expense of public health. Deregulate medical and there will be less burnout, but the pay will be cut in half.

> Regulatory capture Next time you need surgery give me a call. I don't have any relevant qualifications; I have no training; I don't have a professional registration; I don't have insurance; but yeah sure I can watch a few Youtube videos and give it a go.

I will do it for half of whatever parent will charge. We also have ping pong and kombucha on tap in the waiting room.

Re: Doctors and Nurses Are Running on Empty

#82
Anecdote time. My GF is an OT, burnt out as hell, and pushing through it. Walking away means just not being paid for a while, because the options are either 1) go to a different facility, which wouldn't make anything better because the whole industry is struggling with covid, or 2) go to a job outside the industry, which means reskilling or making unskilled wages with a bachelor's+master's sized mountain of student loan debt, or 3) just quitting and burning through savings for a while.

Before covid, it was already an abusive job. She doesn't quit a job that is super abusive because it feels like abandoning patients. Her employers take advantage of that. And then the world goes "thanks docs and nurses" and then the rest of the industry on the front lines is like, yeah I guess we're invisible. And if her wages did go up, everyone would just gripe about how abusive it is that healthcare (a human right!) costs so much. She puts up with so much horrible shit, working so much harder than I do for so much less, because her patients really, really matter to her.

If you judge healthcare workers for walking out, understand that they're dealing with tremendous pressure and abuse. If you judge healthcare workers for not walking out, like they're just getting what's coming, reaping what they sow, understand that they do this for reasons that aren't just money, and be thankful that they are willing to give more than they get.

They're burning out helping people. Have empathy.

Re: Doctors and Nurses Are Running on Empty

#83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alternative healthcare? Let me remind you of the opioid epidemic entirely caused by physicians. To buy dandruff medicine you need to get approval from a Physician, a pharmacist, and pharmacy. Not to mention the actual product regulations. We've had 140 years of regulation. It was to protect healthcare workers at our expense.

Does Thalidomide ring a bell? Because that's what happens with no regulation.

"The US FDA refused to approve thalidomide for marketing and distribution. However, the drug was distributed in large quantities for testing purposes, after the American distributor and manufacturer Richardson-Merrell had applied for its approval in September 1960.[citation needed] The official in charge of the FDA review, Frances Oldham Kelsey, did not rely on information from the company, which did not include any test results. Richardson-Merrell was called on to perform tests and report the results. The company demanded approval six times, and was refused each time. Nevertheless, a total of 17 children with thalidomide-induced malformations were born in the US. Oldham Kelsey was given a Presidential award for distinguished service from the federal government for not allowing thalidomide to be approved for sale in the US.[42] "

Although not perfect, the FDA seemed to do the right thing in the case of Thalidomide.

Re: Doctors and Nurses Are Running on Empty

#84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dedication to, empathy for the humans that would otherwise die is the more likely conclusion. Most people aren't solely motivated by greed. Many nurses have actually had their pay cut during this pandemic and have kept slaving away in garbage bags and cloth masks despite their wholesale mistreatment.

Yeah it's sad people feel pains. I'm also unhappy that those same people have used Regulatory capture to increase their wages at the expense of public health. Deregulate medical and there will be less burnout, but the pay will be cut in half.

[dead]

Re: Doctors and Nurses Are Running on Empty

#85
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They can just quit. But not because they're bad people. When you're really burned out, you don't give half a fuck about anything. It can be the choice between staying and jumping off a bridge one night, or just leaving. I hope not many people experience that kind of stress, but if you do, just walk out. It's always an option.

> just walk out. It's always an option. Not everybody has the same job mobility people on this site do. Walking out could very well result in homelessness for many RNs. Freedom isn't very free when your other choice is to lose the basics you need for survival.

[deleted]

Re: Doctors and Nurses Are Running on Empty

#86
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you imagine seeing headlines about people dying because of people like you walking out during a crisis? And knowing you contributed to those deaths? And where are you going to go? Switch industries in the middle of this? Because if you stay in healthcare, walking out of your single facility doesn't even get you away from the pandemic. I have friends burning out in healthcare, being paid terribly, but sticking i…

They can just quit. But not because they're bad people. When you're really burned out, you don't give half a fuck about anything. It can be the choice between staying and jumping off a bridge one night, or just leaving. I hope not many people experience that kind of stress, but if you do, just walk out. It's always an option.

How’s Facebook treating ya?

Re: Doctors and Nurses Are Running on Empty

#87

Why are degree requirements so high for nurses? What's with this artificially imposed supply shortage?

Did you just completely skip every biology course throughout high school and college?

The human body is fucking complex. Staggeringly, mind-bogglingly so.

And that's just our bodies. Add in just one component of nursing, like medication. We don't even know how most of the drugs we take work - called 'mechanism of action'. We don't know. We just know the shit does work.

Now think about everything that can go wrong with a human body. Nurses are the front line workers that have to deal with that.

Try to think a little before you type next time.

Re: Doctors and Nurses Are Running on Empty

#88

I've got a friend who's a nurse in a local hospital. She's in the OB ward but has a half dozen patients on her floor with Covid. She says at least half is on antianxiety meds (xanax); she just got a talking-to from her doc who refused to refill her prescription. Apparently, the first bottle is available for anyone with the connections, but after that they start talking about addiction and asking questions. They are o…

Cynical take: 30% bonus is there for retention. If you don't stick around for the year to hit the bonus, that's salary they don't need to pay you.

Re: Doctors and Nurses Are Running on Empty

#89
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah it's sad people feel pains. I'm also unhappy that those same people have used Regulatory capture to increase their wages at the expense of public health. Deregulate medical and there will be less burnout, but the pay will be cut in half.

> Regulatory capture Next time you need surgery give me a call. I don't have any relevant qualifications; I have no training; I don't have a professional registration; I don't have insurance; but yeah sure I can watch a few Youtube videos and give it a go.

If you have good Yelp reviews or if I could speak with happy patients I would consider taking you up on it. Seriously.

I've received enough terrible medical and dental care from various "trained" and "registered" practitioners to value referrals much more than any credential or certification.

If you yourself truly believe that a professional registration is satisfactory, then I trust you practice what you preach by never researching doctor reviews. To do so would invalidate your argument.

Re: Doctors and Nurses Are Running on Empty

#90
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> are now routinely making 5-10K a week [...] That's far better money than most soldiers (or even FAANG engineers) make That's not an unusual amount of money to make at L5 after a few years, and unlike the traveling nurse position, it's not temporary. That being said, I'm glad to see hospitals competing on actual worker safety, hopefully this will encourage hospitals to have sustainable stocks of PPE in the future.

L5?

Likely referring to "level 5" at Google: http://levels.fyi/
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