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The CIA's Quest for Mind Control: Torture, LSD and a 'Poisoner in Chief'

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Re: The CIA's Quest for Mind Control: Torture, LSD and a 'Poisoner in Chief'

#101

Post by fvdessen »

AntiImperialist wrote: post #91
forgingahead wrote: post #56

Gottlieb wanted to create a way to seize control of people's minds, and he realized it was a two-part process. First, you had to blast away the existing mind. Second, you had to find a way to insert a new mind into that resulting void. You don't need LSD for this, just expose yourself to media (news, social media, "influencers", etc) and they will helpfully convince you that everything you thought before you encounte…

On a related note: one of the funniest things as a non-westerner to me is that a majority of westerners are convinced that when they vote, if they vote for policies that favor their own country, their own well-being, it is wrong. Here's a hint for those who are struggling: if you're convinced that you should vote against yourself, you've been brainwashed by your enemies. To those who are feeling anger after reading m…

Westerners claim that the vote for selfless do good things, but usually the practical consequences of what they want benefits them personally.

For example they will go to organic shop to 'save the planet' and 'be fair to third world countries', but those shops also exclude the poor and the minorities due to their pricing and thus let them keep their closed communities, while the universalist political message works against the competition from doing the same.

Re: The CIA's Quest for Mind Control: Torture, LSD and a 'Poisoner in Chief'

#102

Post by pjc50 »

jonathanstrange wrote: post #89
forgingahead wrote: post #56

Gottlieb wanted to create a way to seize control of people's minds, and he realized it was a two-part process. First, you had to blast away the existing mind. Second, you had to find a way to insert a new mind into that resulting void. You don't need LSD for this, just expose yourself to media (news, social media, "influencers", etc) and they will helpfully convince you that everything you thought before you encounte…

That's complete and utter conspiracy nonsense because control implicates intentions, but the media - and especially social media - are not directed by a uniform actor with intentions. What you're insinuating to be mind control are normal social mechanisms that have always been in place and have nothing to do with the media. They are primarily exerted upon you by your peers (close friends, family, colleagues), and not…

> the media - and especially social media - are not directed by a uniform actor with intentions.

Well .. in some cases they are; Fox, Sky, News Corp Au. (many local newspapers in Australia), the UK Sun, Times, the WSJ, HarperCollins, and some talk radio stations are all owned by News Corp under Murdoch control and have at times been used to promote his personal politics, endorse parties, bully governments into accepting particular policies, and so on.

Re: The CIA's Quest for Mind Control: Torture, LSD and a 'Poisoner in Chief'

#103

Post by AntiImperialist »

andruby wrote: post #94
AntiImperialist wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On a related note: one of the funniest things as a non-westerner to me is that a majority of westerners are convinced that when they vote, if they vote for policies that favor their own country, their own well-being, it is wrong. Here's a hint for those who are struggling: if you're convinced that you should vote against yourself, you've been brainwashed by your enemies. To those who are feeling anger after reading m…

Some westerners don't identify strongly with a specific country. I am one of those. We might consider the "good" of "all" people above the good of our country. When that is your mindset, voting for policies that favor your own country, your own well-being can in fact feel wrong, if it is at the cost of other people's well-being.

Greater good is often used as a reason to grab power from individuals, whether it is by foreign nations, corporations or even other national government.

I am not talking about that. Groups exist for a reason. The biggest reason is that other groups exist. You can either be attacked by those or join them or create your own. Your group can be a political one, which in some cases may end up having their own nation state. If the group can defend a territory and its resources, sustain it, and gain respect, other groups may eventually acknowledge it. You may take these for granted but these things are not set in stone, they're fluid. Many people in Taiwan, Hong Kong, Palentine think they are a nation state. Most other nation state don't acknowledge them as such... mostly because they're not powerful enough.

You can deny or devalue your own nationality but what you cannot deny is that nation states exist and they have incredible power, because they have to have at least enough power to defend and sustain themselves. They are definitely not the only organized power structures, but they are major ones. Maybe Open Society Foundation is right. Maybe all borders should be open, everything should be controlled by shared ideals with one world government and efficient open economy. They seem to think they have ways to make that work. Maybe they can. But until and unless they do that, we have to live with the ones we have, which grant the citizens certain rights and protections and subjects them to laws and regulations in exchange.

What I am talking about in my previous comment is not these things. I'm talking about the brainwashing by various forces (Open Society Foundation being one of them), which have made nationalism repulsive... by using simple brainwashing techniques. Most of these people would not be able to have a rational conversation about cost/benefits of having nation states or favoring your nation. They're triggered into an emotional response when the topic comes up.

Re: The CIA's Quest for Mind Control: Torture, LSD and a 'Poisoner in Chief'

#104

Post by navaati »

reshyith wrote: post #43
mhh__ wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Preferable in what way? Clearly the CIA has sinned and will likely continue to do so, but how can we evaluate an agency whose job by definition is either totally unseen (Espionage) or only reported on years after the fact (i.e. no one cares about the terrorist attacks that don't happen)

We technically do not evaluate anything of this nature, without acknowledging that there are greater forces which evaluate evaluators. Without that belief, what we get instead, is vigilantism (either within the institution, or outside of it.) Preferable to that, is well-accountable and ethically mutual reflection which brings out the best, and roots out the worst in the participants. That is never impossible, as long…

Not to be too controversial, but that last part only works if you believe there is a god or some sort of cosmic justice. Those of us who don't would like to explore alternative solutions...

Re: The CIA's Quest for Mind Control: Torture, LSD and a 'Poisoner in Chief'

#105

Post by conjectures »

krageon wrote: post #86
ginko wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or you know, maybe Europeans and Americans just have different cultures and values.

If I'm not mistaken their core point is that cultures and values are basically brainwashing.

Nah, every morning god rolls a d6 and on 4+ US are upvoters and Europeans downvoters.

Re: The CIA's Quest for Mind Control: Torture, LSD and a 'Poisoner in Chief'

#106

Post by throwaway743 »

jonathanstrange wrote: post #89
forgingahead wrote: post #56

Gottlieb wanted to create a way to seize control of people's minds, and he realized it was a two-part process. First, you had to blast away the existing mind. Second, you had to find a way to insert a new mind into that resulting void. You don't need LSD for this, just expose yourself to media (news, social media, "influencers", etc) and they will helpfully convince you that everything you thought before you encounte…

That's complete and utter conspiracy nonsense because control implicates intentions, but the media - and especially social media - are not directed by a uniform actor with intentions. What you're insinuating to be mind control are normal social mechanisms that have always been in place and have nothing to do with the media. They are primarily exerted upon you by your peers (close friends, family, colleagues), and not…

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propaganda_model

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mockingbird

Media companies are businesses driven by profits and content, from advertisers and sources (at times supposed) who must be kept happy.

Re: The CIA's Quest for Mind Control: Torture, LSD and a 'Poisoner in Chief'

#107

Post by 3131s »

AntiImperialist wrote: post #91
forgingahead wrote: post #56

Gottlieb wanted to create a way to seize control of people's minds, and he realized it was a two-part process. First, you had to blast away the existing mind. Second, you had to find a way to insert a new mind into that resulting void. You don't need LSD for this, just expose yourself to media (news, social media, "influencers", etc) and they will helpfully convince you that everything you thought before you encounte…

On a related note: one of the funniest things as a non-westerner to me is that a majority of westerners are convinced that when they vote, if they vote for policies that favor their own country, their own well-being, it is wrong. Here's a hint for those who are struggling: if you're convinced that you should vote against yourself, you've been brainwashed by your enemies. To those who are feeling anger after reading m…

No. Under a reasonable set of values "what's good for the US" and "what's good for the world" are so often aligned that it's a very good heuristic.

Re: The CIA's Quest for Mind Control: Torture, LSD and a 'Poisoner in Chief'

#108

Post by jacobush »

AntiImperialist wrote: post #91
forgingahead wrote: post #56

Gottlieb wanted to create a way to seize control of people's minds, and he realized it was a two-part process. First, you had to blast away the existing mind. Second, you had to find a way to insert a new mind into that resulting void. You don't need LSD for this, just expose yourself to media (news, social media, "influencers", etc) and they will helpfully convince you that everything you thought before you encounte…

On a related note: one of the funniest things as a non-westerner to me is that a majority of westerners are convinced that when they vote, if they vote for policies that favor their own country, their own well-being, it is wrong. Here's a hint for those who are struggling: if you're convinced that you should vote against yourself, you've been brainwashed by your enemies. To those who are feeling anger after reading m…

”If what I say makes you angry I’m right and you are brainwashed.”

Re: The CIA's Quest for Mind Control: Torture, LSD and a 'Poisoner in Chief'

#109

Post by kthxbye123 »

forgingahead wrote: post #56

Gottlieb wanted to create a way to seize control of people's minds, and he realized it was a two-part process. First, you had to blast away the existing mind. Second, you had to find a way to insert a new mind into that resulting void. You don't need LSD for this, just expose yourself to media (news, social media, "influencers", etc) and they will helpfully convince you that everything you thought before you encounte…

So true. When someone gets mad at me online for saying that black people have genetically bad IQs or that it’s ok to run over protestors with my car, that’s the dark hand of the CIA at work.

Re: The CIA's Quest for Mind Control: Torture, LSD and a 'Poisoner in Chief'

#110

Post by kthxbye123 »

OneGuy123 wrote: post #78
forgingahead wrote: post #56

Gottlieb wanted to create a way to seize control of people's minds, and he realized it was a two-part process. First, you had to blast away the existing mind. Second, you had to find a way to insert a new mind into that resulting void. You don't need LSD for this, just expose yourself to media (news, social media, "influencers", etc) and they will helpfully convince you that everything you thought before you encounte…

This is why 4chan is great: no accounts, no up or downvotes. You will find all kind of people there, each topic will be explored from 300 different perspectives.

290 of which are “how do we solve the Jewish Problem”
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