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I Miss Working from the Office

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Re: I Miss Working from the Office

#111

Post by Jugurtha »

w0utert wrote: post #82
Jugurtha wrote: post #65

Yes. Some people on the internet were also advocating for a return to the office because people could not stand the loneliness anymore and need to interact socially. I had to point out that this was symptomatic of a poor social/family life [outside of work]. If someone is lonely working remotely and they miss humans, it is a sign the only humans they interacted with were colleagues. It's also a sign of what the perso…

I don’t understand this comment, do you suggest all forms of social contacts are created equal and people should just replace the social interactions they used to have with co-workers by visiting their family more often, organizing more poker nights with friends or taking salsa classes or whatever? That makes absolutely no sense, these interactions are completely different from those you would have with your co-worke…

>I don’t understand this comment, do you suggest all forms of social contacts are created equal and people should just replace the social interactions they used to have with co-workers by visiting their family more often, organizing more poker nights with friends or taking salsa classes or whatever?

I don't understand this comment. Do you suggest all your family members and friends have lower value than your work colleagues and it's okay to let them suffer? Or are you saying that all unemployed people should suffer the consequences of not having coworkers?

See what I did here? It's called a strawman argument. You didn't say that, but someone on the internet could easily do that to something you said and turn it into something you didn't say, write, or mean.

What I am saying is that this pandemic is taking a toll on many people and has exposed crutches we relied on before COVID. What I'm also saying is that these give us hints on what we can try to improve.

Re: I Miss Working from the Office

#112

Post by satyrnein »

st1x7 wrote: post #48

I think that what isn't discussed enough is the variance in quality of your office environment and of your home office and how that quality affects your preferences about working from home. It sounds quite obvious but in these arguments people often just state what they personally like and leave it at that. Your office can be place where you still have the option to work uninterrupted but also get the benefits of fac…

Also, oftentimes your work-office experience and home-office experience are inversely correlated. Before the pandemic, the tradeoff was to live in the city in a cramped space to be close to the office (and other amenities), or to live further away with a lot more space, but have to deal with a commute.

The people who chose proximity are still paying high rent, but have lost the benefits, and are now trying to make do with laptops on their couches. The people who chose space have big desks, two monitors, comfortable chairs, and now don't have a soul crushing commute anymore.

The change in circumstances hits very differently based on what (perfectly valid) choices you made earlier.

Re: I Miss Working from the Office

#113

Post by ricardo81 »

matthewmacleod wrote: post #70

I'd like to think that after the n th discussion of this topic we could all generally agree: - Some people prefer working in an office environment. There are valid reasons for this, and it's totally fine. - Other people prefer working at home, and this is also completely fine and understandable. - People other than yourself who experience challenges with either one of these arrangements are not idiots and the things…

I agree with the sentiment of your creative approach. I think a good middle ground is having offices in neighbourhoods, within walking/cycling distance where people from different companies come to work. They get the benefit of social interaction, "getting out of the house", and avoid a car journey.

Living in the UK, I think that would also help restore the feeling of community, as a gathering point for people within a local area.

Personally I prefer working from home and have done so for 20 years, almost all my working life- but I understand why people have reasons for preferring an alternative.

Re: I Miss Working from the Office

#114

Post by Scarblac »

Jugurtha wrote: post #65

Yes. Some people on the internet were also advocating for a return to the office because people could not stand the loneliness anymore and need to interact socially. I had to point out that this was symptomatic of a poor social/family life [outside of work]. If someone is lonely working remotely and they miss humans, it is a sign the only humans they interacted with were colleagues. It's also a sign of what the perso…

It's not so black and white. Regardless of my social life outside of work, I loved the job I have precisely because there are so many nice people I get to share fourty hours per week with. And I miss them.

Re: I Miss Working from the Office

#115

Post by irrational »

I only live about 10-15 minutes from campus and campus is beautiful. I get along great with my coworkers and boss. My current working arrangement is sitting in a chair in the corner of the living room with my computer on my lap and all the kids are there also doing there school work. All of this might make it sound like I can’t wait to get back to campus. To be honest just the thought makes me nauseous. I’ve loved working from home and would be thrilled to be able to continue working remotely from here on out.

I love rolling out of bed and immediately starting to work. I love not having to waste time getting dressed and driving to work, but using that time to work. I love not being interrupted constantly by coworkers. I love using my own bathroom. I love having immediate access to my own kitchen. I love being able to see my family more frequently. I love getting more work done.

Unfortunately, my work has made it very plain that we will be going back to working in the office at some point (probably has something to do with them completing an additional 5 million square feet of new office space this year).

Re: I Miss Working from the Office

#116

Post by CraigJPerry »

bamboozled wrote: post #10

Thing I miss are: * Having someone clean my works space. My house gets dirtier now and I’m forever cleaning it, doing dishes. * The distinction between the beginning and end of my work day. * Having free space in my house. * Off the cuff dinner and drinks with colleagues. * No lag meetings and whiteboard sessions. * Having intervals apart from my family actually felt healthy, although we have adapted to being around…

>> * The distinction between the beginning and end of my work day.

>> * When someone of greater rank than me in an inconvenient time zone wants to have a meeting with me involved, I have to attend. I’ve practically lost all my mornings from 6am - 9am, 3-4 days a week.

You know your situation best obviously but to a random outsider this sounds like the (reeeeeeally) common issue of not being well practiced at saying no.

Re: I Miss Working from the Office

#117

Post by dandellion »

st1x7 wrote: post #48

I think that what isn't discussed enough is the variance in quality of your office environment and of your home office and how that quality affects your preferences about working from home. It sounds quite obvious but in these arguments people often just state what they personally like and leave it at that. Your office can be place where you still have the option to work uninterrupted but also get the benefits of fac…

That's a very good point, I'm really enjoying working from home and I attributed it mostly to not having to do the one hour commute each way, but there's so many more things that add up:

- At home I have the most comfortable chair I could find on the market that fits me perfectly. At work there are very basic adjustable chairs and they use some slippery fabric.

- At home I have an ergonomic mechanical keyboard vs. a cheap rubber dome keyboard that kept running out of batteries at work.

- An ergonomic mouse, vs. a tiny mouse that doesn't even have a back button.

- Two 27" 4k monitors, vs. a single 24" monitor.

- Always a nice room temperature, vs. often being too hot or too cold.

- Bathroom always available, vs. sometimes having to wait to use the bathroom.

- No interruptions, vs. occasional interruptions.

- Working in silence, vs. having to use noise cancelling headphone and listening to music when I don't want to.

To me the only drawbacks are that Zoom meetings are worse than in-person and not being able to have hallway discussions, but the many gains in quality of life easily make up for that. But the situation could easily reverse for someone who only has a tiny laptop and no room for a home office.

Re: I Miss Working from the Office

#118

Post by Jugurtha »

Scarblac wrote: post #114
Jugurtha wrote: post #65

Yes. Some people on the internet were also advocating for a return to the office because people could not stand the loneliness anymore and need to interact socially. I had to point out that this was symptomatic of a poor social/family life [outside of work]. If someone is lonely working remotely and they miss humans, it is a sign the only humans they interacted with were colleagues. It's also a sign of what the perso…

It's not so black and white. Regardless of my social life outside of work, I loved the job I have precisely because there are so many nice people I get to share fourty hours per week with. And I miss them.

It's far from being black and white, hence the effort to improve. What I said does in no way mean one does not love their job or miss their coworkers, it simply means there is a situation with problems that could give us pointers on what we can improve.

Re: I Miss Working from the Office

#119

Post by hemloc_io »

mrweasel wrote: post #15

The biggest one for is, as mentioned in the article: casuasl collaboration. I mis being able to just walk over to a coworker. I’m just home every other week, which strikes a reasonable balance for me.

Something that doesn't get brought up is this + onboarding jr devs/new grads.

The mentorship programs don't really work in my experience without actually being able to talk to them.

Re: I Miss Working from the Office

#120

Post by graderjs »

matthewmacleod wrote: post #70

I'd like to think that after the n th discussion of this topic we could all generally agree: - Some people prefer working in an office environment. There are valid reasons for this, and it's totally fine. - Other people prefer working at home, and this is also completely fine and understandable. - People other than yourself who experience challenges with either one of these arrangements are not idiots and the things…

I think office work should be an option companies provide, and it should be like an AirOffice, floating, in co-working or "business center" office space, or even ad-hoc such as at such and such a cool, wifi, remote work friendly cafe. I think this is the future of work and that's how I want to run my company when it employs people. I had this idea since around 2010/2011.

I know this won't work for everything. Factories obviously need to be staffed (so far). But for 'knowledge work' we should be able to work anywhere, including, if the need arises, to rent private digs and all get together in person.

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