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Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla and the Unfortunate Implications

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Re: Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla and the Unfortunate Implications

#181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> These days you can't have a woman who wants to be a housewife on your show unless that's being portrayed negatively or being poked fun at. Is that really true though? If you mean that you can't have a houswife as a character on your show that very obviously isn't true. If you mean you can't make a show where a character aspires to be a housewife, I'm not sure I understand what the narrative purpose of such a story…

Housewife characters are uncommon, and they tend to be portrayed as vapid, boring, incompetent or else otherwise their occupation is the butt of the joke (e.g., “Claire” in Modern Family who is as intelligent as any of the characters but is a low key alcoholic and eventually breaks free of her housewife occupation to become an executive at her father’s company).

I think this is more a case of only noticing them as housewives when it gets called to your attention. Neutral/warm depictions of housewives are incredibly common but don't grab your attention because of how ordinary they are. It doesn't exactly stand out in most people's minds when they see a caring mother figure or a loving spouse.

If you want a return to the sanitary, saccharine dom coms of the sort the Simpsons was originally a parody of, I have to vehemently disagree that there is any real desire for that.

Re: Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla and the Unfortunate Implications

#182
I loved this article for the many cognitive dissonances it brings into light. Some of them are internalized by the author, and for some other he has to carefully maneuver around them.

First, I would like to point out that it is evident, obvious, absolutely certain that the person writing this blog is a white american liberal. Why? Because while they can make pedantic remarks about weapons, armors, clothes -- which are badly depicted within the game as a result of errors or ignorance --, they will openly switch their stance, and make pedantic remarks but this time justifying the choices of the developers, as long as they are errors that are done to enforce a false narrative. Of course, this "false narrative" I am referring to is a progressive narrative: here, that 9th century England was racially diverse, as it _should_, and that some "primitive" sympathetic people like Danes or Norses were gender equal, as they _should_.

Even in the world of things the author is allegedly unbothered about, there is a hierarchy of things to be unbothered about in a positive or in a negative way.

Continuing from this perspective, the efforts of the author to pursue his pedantic analysis can only be very arduous. Because he has to analyze blatant lies in a pedantic way, but still maintain a conclusion that will be seen as progressive (something along the lines of: there is a more abstract interpretation of all of this that shows that white people are the real culprits in all of this, even though they are openly depicted as evil and ridiculed in every way).

So... the author remarks that Vikings are represented as racially diverse, gender-equal, generally the "good guys" (a "good guy" in pop culture is usually someone who possess anachronic progressive liberal values). These good guys are opposed to the Saxons -- indigenous whites, who are Christian, who wear boring mail, who are religious fanatics, and patriarchal.

One could think that this was the intent, that Ubisoft is simply pandering to American racial justice narratives by painting world progress as a fight against traditional white societies. The simple manicheism used throughout the story makes it simply too obvious...

But, NO. That answer would fall in the category of "bad conclusions", and even though the author is pedantic, he can't go there due to his liberal _essence_.

Hence the need for him to abstract every piece of evidence, and every obvious conclusion that the creators of this game are stupidly pushing their social agenda, in order to reframe those ideas in a light that blames whites.

The way to do this? It is quite astute. It consists in abstracting the very ideas of the developers to ridicule whites and acclaim diverse societies, and to claim that those offensive representations are ACTUALLY toxic white representations of colonialism.

> And that, of course is the problem: the broader implications of this kind of game design for thinking about colonialism. I do not think we are all collectively bothered by how Viking-themed products make us think about 9th century settler colonialism in Northern Europe. But colonialism more broadly, and the still popular fantasy of colonists finding empty ‘virgin’ lands to settle, is still a major issue in the consciousness and politics of many countries.

Namely, that even though no one cares that peasants in 9th century England were massacred, we should be WARY of it because of OTHER INSTANCES of white colonialism. Indeed, every bad in history is bad not for objective reasons, but because at some point whites did it and it was bad. This is a caricature, but very close to reality.

And in all, it is a clever argumentation. Picture a far-right person, who after analyzing demography and the general trends in American or European culture would see in this game the exact evil he is fighting against. Precisely: that there is a dominant trend in all pop culture and the entertainment industry to present dominantly white european countries (or the U.S., which still is demographically a dominantly white european country) and their cultures as 'virgin' islands, that should be forced open to massive foreign immigration by international treaties. And that the laws, customs and religion of these countries (Christianism, hello) should be considered equal or inferior to foreign incoming values (hello """paganism""").

Well, the only way to fight this point is to reverse all the obvious, and go from a concrete to an abstract point of view. See:

> Let’s consider this through our heuristic of “what would we think about this if it were a religion other than Christianity?” Imagine a game where your character comes upon a Buddhist monk in a small shrine and easily talks them into violating their vows by acquiring some property or engaging in sexual intercourse (using reasoning from your religious tradition, no less), after which they thank you and then the game rewards you experience for having desecrated their sacred vows. This is roughly what you do with the anchoress (whose vow is to stay isolated and in place).

Anyone would see this as an attack on christianity by liberal values, namely individualism and hedonism that lead to a disrespect and subversion of people wanting to adopt a religious way of life (these liberal values are represented in the game by the token paganism of the Norse). But NOPE. You CANNOT go this way! First, blame whites. Then, go to an abstract level where you can still blame them.

> Now look, I get it, Christianity in 9th century England was an intolerant, hegemonic religion. But you are a foreign colonizing invader rolling in wrecking their holy sites, (not) killing their religious practitioners and toppling their governments: you are intolerant and hegemonic too!

This is a typical "fake middle ground" centrist point of view. "I agree they are nazis and should be beat up, BUT DON'T BE TOO ROUGH WITH THEM OR YOU MIGHT START TO RESEMBLE THEM." It only ever serves to further bring the knife under the neck of whoever is being beat up.

> And of course that plays straight back into the problem with sanitizing Scandinavian raiding, slavery, and gender roles: the Christian Saxons do not get the same treatment, setting up this stark contrast between an a-historically pure and moral set of Norse characters and a more historically grounded, flawed Christian Saxon society (all the more awkward because one of the things the Christian church militated against in Scandinavian society was slavery, since many of the enslaved people there were Christian).

> And this is my Eivor’s boat-cat. He is adorable and fortunately, unlike the rest of this game, not a white-wash of colonialism.

The author, a proud white liberal, has failed to recognize his own worldview behind the token paganism of these racially diverse / gender equal imaginary Norse people. He still thinks that the problem in this is that _people could see Norse characters as good_, and not that they have been made token protagonists to enforce his own cultural values.

The conclusion of this article is a delusion:

> To be clear, my preference here is not for Ubisoft to have not made this game, my preference here would be for Scandinavian settlement in England to have been presented, warts and all.

Having argued that this game is Bad (it COULD give white people a positive view of colonialism, because they're inherently prone to Nazism), and that even though it became bad for Good reasons (he neutrally points out that the creators censored and distorted reality, because they were just happy to depict the colonization of white people and to demonize christianism), he now expresses the wish that the developers had made a better job of showing the horrors of the pillage and erasure of a culture. It, of course, runs contrary to his beliefs expressed in the introduction that there's no fuss in falsely portraying a white society as racially diverse or any other distortions as long as it's to enforce a progressive agenda.

This is the epiphany of cognitive dissonance, "SHOW THE TRUTH to fight white nazis" vs. "HIDE THE TRUTH to fight white nazis". And I am happy to point this out, in the most pedantic way that anyone could think of.

For a final point of fun, read this:

Ubisoft, please: do better. Earn that title card about your diverse team.

And realize that the author missed that the whole point of this game was to show (CHAD "pagan" diversity) vs. (VIRGIN white christianism) and that he distorted it into a bizarre plot that would somehow reinforce the worldviews of Nazis.

-----------------------

I am well aware that someone will pedanticly argue that the author put up a minor disclaimer in parenthesis to make it seem as he is taking the "middle ground" between all these issues, and that he's the voice of reason / objectivity. My claim is that it is mostly bullshit noise, and that pedanticism is a nice game for nerds until it has to be tamed and distorted to defend some ideology.

The fact that the author cannot argue even one second that this game is symbolically anti-white colonial propaganda, and have to resort to a universalist position ("I would do the same for any religion / people / etc. !") but without naming once the target of the propaganda... It is funny. That's a funny piece, from an astute contorted liberal white pedant.

Re: Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla and the Unfortunate Implications

#183

I have no interest in these games, nor do I expect them to have any historical merit. My only observation is that the hard points of this article appear to be that the game aggressively asserts cultural superiority of the Norse over the evil, or, much worse, weak willed Christians who appreciate being shown non-Christian views; as well as as vaguely racist depictions of weak Saxony. Whatever your views on Christian (…

I think you lost the forest for the trees in the blog post's arguments. The treatment of Christianity and depiction of the Saxons is only part of the bigger problem of a colonizer narrative. Big issues in actual history are just glossed over, like the Viking use of slaves and collateral damage to civilians.

The argument is that pretending that the Vikings were unilaterally the good guys is an irresponsible thing to do when your game claims to be made by a multicultural team (AKA "we're trying to be sensitive about it") and when the game series has always tried to weave the stories into real-world settings.

One of the interesting things the author points out is that they were open about slavery in a previous game set in the Caribbean, but it's almost never mentioned here despite its historical prominence in the setting.

Re: Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla and the Unfortunate Implications

#184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a player you cannot do _anything whatsoever_ to change the setting and rules of the game: you cannot be nicer or less nice to the indigenous people, you have to loot and destroy their religious centers, you have endure having their religion mocked by your compatriots, you cannot convert to the local religion... You have to play a Aryan colonial invader who disdains the local culture and religion because your own c…

Spec Ops: The Line [0][1] puts a nice spin on just that. You have agency. Just stop playing [2]. It might just be the most harrowing game I've ever played. [0] - https://store.steampowered.com/app/50300/Spec_Ops_The_Line/ [1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dzstxE_5Rc [2] - https://i.imgur.com/VSi8EOG.jpg

[deleted]

Re: Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla and the Unfortunate Implications

#185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a player you cannot do _anything whatsoever_ to change the setting and rules of the game: you cannot be nicer or less nice to the indigenous people, you have to loot and destroy their religious centers, you have endure having their religion mocked by your compatriots, you cannot convert to the local religion... You have to play a Aryan colonial invader who disdains the local culture and religion because your own c…

Spec Ops: The Line [0][1] puts a nice spin on just that. You have agency. Just stop playing [2]. It might just be the most harrowing game I've ever played. [0] - https://store.steampowered.com/app/50300/Spec_Ops_The_Line/ [1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dzstxE_5Rc [2] - https://i.imgur.com/VSi8EOG.jpg

Spec Ops: The Line was trying to make that point with respect to you, the player, committing virtual war crimes. I thought it was clumsily executed, but it had a point. You knew what you were doing and the game told you it was wrong.

The problem with Assassin's Creed Valhalla is that, rather than presenting you with the option to kill civilians and take slaves and letting you choose not to participate in this aspect of the time period/history, the game is hiding that historical fact in order to let you safely indulge in a sanitized historical fantasy. As a player who doesn't know better (AKA most people in the world), you don't even know the alternative you could be choosing.

Re: Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla and the Unfortunate Implications

#186
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> I've grown up in a period when pop culture didn't care much about cultural sensitivity. >Same, and as unpopular it may be, i firmly believe it's kind of better to not care. As a white dude, I've found that "not caring about it" means "only white male characters are allowed" I've noticed that folks who "don't care about it" actually care A LARGE AMOUNT, A VERY VERY LARGE AMOUNT, when a non-male or non-white protago…

That sexuality of a character in a game is even known is problematic; this implies the sexuality is being acted on. I wish developers would stop exploiting the four Fs to induce us to buy, and sadly my minimal consumption of video games is only a splash against the tide.

I don't think there's anything wrong with a video game character being gay, straight, or otherwise. for the most part, I do think video game romances are incredibly poorly done. I have not yet played a game where the romantic/sexual tension was not intensely cringey. we are still deep in the uncanny valley here. usually it's a fully optional side arc (eg, mass effect), so I can't say it's much of a problem in practice.

Re: Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla and the Unfortunate Implications

#187
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is dangerous stuff. What if there was an Assassin's Creed that showed slavery in a positive light? Or the glory of killing Rightists in China in the 50s? Or Turks killing Armenians in 1918? People might look into it, but a lot of people are going to take it at face value and even if they do look it up, there initial exposure is going to color their expectations.

Then don’t take your ethical values from video games? This Puritanization of all art and entertainment is disturbing.

if you deny the influence of pop-culture on how people see the past, you're deluding yourself.

Re: Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla and the Unfortunate Implications

#188

Vikings invade England, pillage and massacre the English, yet they are still seen as the good guys. I wonder if the people who made this game have some historical resentment towards the English.

Vikings invade England, pillage and massacre the English, yet they are still seen as the good guys. It's curious that what is now Britain has been invaded and its people enslaved many times over the centuries but no modern day British person harbours any resentment for it towards present day Italians, Scandinavians, French, Moroccans...

We were never taught that we were invaded by those nations - history lessons talk about “Romans”, “Saxons”, and “Normans”. None of those nations are around any more, so the obvious conclusion is that we must’ve “won”, probably by virtue of England being the strongest most pure-blooded nation, or something like that...

Re: Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla and the Unfortunate Implications

#189
post #84

I think what people are missing is that this is a work of fiction. Any work of fiction is entitled to do whatever it wants really. So what if it white washes stuff for the masses, maybe thats a good thing. If people experience the past only as a fictional place where people are gentle and sensitive, if there is wide acknowledgment of race and gender, in the way that we actually want from our society today, isn’t that…

>I think what people are missing is that this is a work of fiction. Any work of fiction is entitled to do whatever it wants really. I think you may want to qualify that statement a little bit. The author covers this point as well: "Imagine the equivalent of a game set in the American South or the Caribbean pre-1865 in which slavery was simply not present at all" Would you have any issues with AC:Confederacy game, whe…

I was mostly talking about the usual HN commentary that I see on this and similar topics, sorry if I was misleading or not specific enough.

I don’t believe creators are obliged to create the most accurate thing that every expert expects, in fact for a lot of topics experts disagree so that might be impossible to accomplish.

They can focus on some things, ignore others, I mean thats what a work of fiction really is. As they say no model is perfect, some models are useful.

Historically good works of fiction provide a catalyst for social commentary, no need to be perfect, and they can focus on the specific issues they want.

For example I wouldn’t call “Paradise Lost” in any way accurate, but it had a profound effect on society, arguable for the better, when it was published.

If we’re expected to view works of art from the context of their time, and not associate modern sensibilities to them, the I would guess modern works should also be viewed through the modern lens too. I’m personally happy with that, as long as we’re engaging and talking about the missing pieces.

Re: Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla and the Unfortunate Implications

#190

> Now, do I think that the developers set out to create a sanitized defense of colonialism (much less an apologia for Nazi race ideology)? Of course not. But they ended up doing it anyway. I agree with the article's main points, but I think the author gives the game's creators too much credit here. You could tell from the first trailer that this game was going to engage in historical revisionism of the "the Vikings w…

"They may (or may not) have intended to defend colonialism in general, but this game is an entirely intentional attempt to defend _Viking_ colonialism specifically."

I see it rather as an entirely intentional attempt to defend colonialism of _Christian_ countries specifically, which also explains how they saw no problem with this while pointing out that they had such a diverse team working on the project.

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