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Information overload helps fake news spread

scientificamerican.com

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Re: Information overload helps fake news spread

#131

Post by klyrs »

chordalkeyboard wrote: post #120
_y5hn wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. This is just hijacking criticism of authority, to start an authoritarian cult of lies, bullying and manipulation.

again, "what evidence would you expect to see?" Also, I hardly think that the notion that people conspired to cheat an election is extraordinary. Rather it would be extraordinary if they did not. Also as regards the suspension of belief necessary to consider elections overseas to be corrupt but not in this bastion of freedom and democracy, the good ol' U.S.A.

There have been quite a few lawsuits about the alleged conspiracies to cheat the election. Most of them have been thrown out for lack of evidence.

But yeah, conspiracy to cheat the election has occurred in the last few days. Thankfully, those efforts have failed spectacularly.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/wayne-county-republican-canvassers...

Re: Information overload helps fake news spread

#132

Post by Fnoord »

nillium wrote: post #32

Shameless plug, but this is something we are working on right now. Social media is a terrible medium for news. Aside from the ability for anyone to post anything, which can easily lead to misinformation, it also sets up the absolute worst incentives. If news organizations are expected to share their reporting for free, and only be able to monetize when someone clicks through to their page -- you end up with clickbait…

Please make it clear earlier its US specific. If I go to waitlist, it asks for my ZIP code, showing greyed out 12345, nor does it allow me to select any country. 12345 isn't the format we use here. Kind of an odd way to say 'we don't serve your kind here'.

That being said, I heard in a local podcast about an initiative for local news platform, but more to get directly reporters to get paid instead of a middle man as newspaper (the platform just allowed to select your city, and they had themselves very low margins). Margins for local news are already really thin due to lack of amount of potential interest. Some is even state sponsored. Its a tough market for sure. I forgot the name of the platform (it was partially still being build ie. only a number of pilot cities), which is kind of telling, I guess.

Re: Information overload helps fake news spread

#133

Post by KittenInABox »

Nacdor wrote: post #114
KittenInABox wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if Bari Weiss can be part of this. Bari Weiss had apparently been slamming her co workers in public during a company-wide meeting. If I knew my co worker was publicly insulting me on twitter while we were in a meeting together I would also call for my co worker to no longer be my co worker for contributing to a hostile workplace.

Was that before or after this: > My work and my character are openly demeaned on company-wide Slack channels where masthead editors regularly weigh in. There, some coworkers insist I need to be rooted out if this company is to be a truly “inclusive” one, while others post ax emojis next to my name. https://www.bariweiss.com/resignation-letter

I have no idea and the only proof is her claim there; we have proof she was publicly shittalking her co workers on her twitter, which she doesn't own up to in her resignation letter.

Re: Information overload helps fake news spread

#134

Post by nillium »

Fnoord wrote: post #132
nillium wrote: post #32

Shameless plug, but this is something we are working on right now. Social media is a terrible medium for news. Aside from the ability for anyone to post anything, which can easily lead to misinformation, it also sets up the absolute worst incentives. If news organizations are expected to share their reporting for free, and only be able to monetize when someone clicks through to their page -- you end up with clickbait…

Please make it clear earlier its US specific. If I go to waitlist, it asks for my ZIP code, showing greyed out 12345, nor does it allow me to select any country. 12345 isn't the format we use here. Kind of an odd way to say 'we don't serve your kind here'. That being said, I heard in a local podcast about an initiative for local news platform, but more to get directly reporters to get paid instead of a middle man as…

Apologies -- we are US specific at the moment. We have nothing against other countries, of course; but this requires us building relationships with individual news organizations and reporters, and we have to start somewhere -- so we are starting closer to home.

We're journalists ourselves, and know the challenges well. This project was really born out of our frustration seeing so many local newspapers in the US filing for bankruptcy, or being hollowed out by hedge funds. We want local news to succeed, and a lot of that has to do with reclaiming some of the traffic and ad revenue now going to those who are not doing the reporting.

Re: Information overload helps fake news spread

#136

Post by Fnoord »

nillium wrote: post #134
Fnoord wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please make it clear earlier its US specific. If I go to waitlist, it asks for my ZIP code, showing greyed out 12345, nor does it allow me to select any country. 12345 isn't the format we use here. Kind of an odd way to say 'we don't serve your kind here'. That being said, I heard in a local podcast about an initiative for local news platform, but more to get directly reporters to get paid instead of a middle man as…

Apologies -- we are US specific at the moment. We have nothing against other countries, of course; but this requires us building relationships with individual news organizations and reporters, and we have to start somewhere -- so we are starting closer to home. We're journalists ourselves, and know the challenges well. This project was really born out of our frustration seeing so many local newspapers in the US filin…

Thanks, and good luck!

I can't remember the initiative launched in my country, but I did find a website which has a similar implementation [1]. Its only in Dutch though.

The icons above read: Timeline, Small Facts, 911 emergencies, News, Business, Bankruptcies, Wanted, Video, Buildings (literally "look inside"), Airbnb, Events, Permits

The icons are standardized on every city page, something I dig.

The timeline is shown by default.

People can click on their city/town and even their neighborhood.

After I wrote this, I saw another one, Drimble [2]. I like that even better than Ozoo (the features seem to be on par I just prefer the UI and colours), but I haven't used either TBH.

I don't believe either of these is the one I heard on the podcast. Also, I'm not quite sure how these websites arrange the rights fair and square, and since we're talking about local business and the little men I find that important. I think they get away with it by quoting, which falls under fair use, and then linking to the original source. That's not exactly the same as your product, nor the one I heard in the podcast.

[1] https://www.oozo.nl/gemeenten/nieuws

[2] https://drimble.nl

Re: Information overload helps fake news spread

#137

Post by vrperson »

The article seems to be all over the place and mixes interesting phenomena like human biases and fallacies with pure speculation, like claiming "bots can easily ruin social networks" which they infer from merely running simulations. Obviously their simulation doesn't prove anything about the nature of networks of real humans (as one example).

Afaik their Botometer tool is also highly disputed, supposedly having way too many false positives.

They also use supposed "independent fact checkers" for reference, when those "independent fact checkers" on Facebook and Twitter are decidedly left leaning. This in turn casts doubt on their conclusions on the differences between Democrats and Republicans (for example something like Republicans are more likely to believe fake news as verified by independent fact checkers - or maybe left leaning fact checkers are more likely to label "conservative news" as fake news).

Ironically, the whole article is too long to comment on it all, kind of supporting the title of it (information overload helps spread fake news).

I find it very concerning how people start to overly rely on "studies". It really needs to become common knowledge that a "study of this" or a "study of that" really doesn't prove anything just yet. Those studies need to be scrutinized and verified and replicated, and properly interpreted.

Re: Information overload helps fake news spread

#138

Post by daniellarusso »

onecommentman wrote: post #42
jasonv wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reading HN though, every assertion from someone who knows something can become a thread of dispute, disagreements and "yeah, but" digressions. So, maybe, who knows anything..

“Who knows anything” sounds dangerously close to nihilism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihilism The problem is nihilists never produce anything of lasting value. Or of any value. It seems to be the posture of those who feel like failures, and justify that perceived failure to themselves by telling themselves that nothing is worth anything. Perhaps others hold that position too. It seems like a dead end in a lot of w…

Sounds exhausting.

Re: Information overload helps fake news spread

#139

Post by bosswipe »

nprz wrote: post #26
bosswipe wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I may paraphrase you, "it feels (without evidence) like there's a giant conspiracy across many organizations involving hundreds or thousands of people acting in coordination, this implies an unknown secret powerful central propaganda ministry that hatches plans to further upcoming moves".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZggCipbiHwE

I suspect that their is some level of coordination and conspiracy across right-wing propaganda channels such as your clip from Sinclair stations. Though all those Sinclair stations are one organization.

But your suspicioun that Scientific American is in the know of a coming push for censorship and is tayloring propaganda on that basis makes absolutely no sense to me.

Re: Information overload helps fake news spread

#140

Post by TechBro8615 »

galaxyLogic wrote: post #113
newacct583 wrote: post #2

I sympathize with people who want to see a technological basis for this, I really do. I just don't buy it. We just saw a press conference an hour ago by the executive office of the most powerful nation in the world allege with a straight face that the recent election was tainted by Canadian election machines running malicious software written by Venezuela, Cuba, "likely" China, and directed by George Soros and (from…

There should be a penalty for spreading lies. And further your reach, the bigger the number of followers you have, the bigger the penalty should be.

Yes, and perhaps President-Elect Biden can setup an office to handle dissemination of these lies. Perhaps he could call it The Ministry of Truth.
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