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Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

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Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#161

Post by sorokod »

bit-rot wrote: post #126
tachyonbeam wrote: post #3

If I say "you are the master of your own destiny", is that offensive, because the word "master" is always offensive? I think that "main branch" sounds fine, it makes as much sense as "master branch", but I'm irked that people are always caving to word policing. Like, we're just going to scratch a whole bunch of words from the dictionary because someone somewhere is offended? The other day, people at my workplace were…

What's funny to me about your comment is that you actually chose a perfect example of the importance of critical thinking in how we discuss terminology. The message behind the English idiom you chose is clearly one of self empowerment; /you/ are the master of /your own/ destiny implies independence, freedom, and agency. In the context of git, and distributed systems more broadly, `master` is specifically chosen for i…

Do you care that in this context the meaning of master is "an original from which copies can be made" or is it irrelevant as you want to have bit of rightous rage?

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#162

Post by Papirola »

bit-rot wrote: post #126
tachyonbeam wrote: post #3

If I say "you are the master of your own destiny", is that offensive, because the word "master" is always offensive? I think that "main branch" sounds fine, it makes as much sense as "master branch", but I'm irked that people are always caving to word policing. Like, we're just going to scratch a whole bunch of words from the dictionary because someone somewhere is offended? The other day, people at my workplace were…

What's funny to me about your comment is that you actually chose a perfect example of the importance of critical thinking in how we discuss terminology. The message behind the English idiom you chose is clearly one of self empowerment; /you/ are the master of /your own/ destiny implies independence, freedom, and agency. In the context of git, and distributed systems more broadly, `master` is specifically chosen for i…

Can we change the use of the symbol + for addition? it reminds me of the suffering my people went through at the hands of the Inquisition and the crusades.

thanks!

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#163

Post by shishy »

sorokod wrote: post #161
bit-rot wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's funny to me about your comment is that you actually chose a perfect example of the importance of critical thinking in how we discuss terminology. The message behind the English idiom you chose is clearly one of self empowerment; /you/ are the master of /your own/ destiny implies independence, freedom, and agency. In the context of git, and distributed systems more broadly, `master` is specifically chosen for i…

Do you care that in this context the meaning of master is "an original from which copies can be made" or is it irrelevant as you want to have bit of rightous rage?

He said:

> Whether this is intentionally "bad" holds no meaning whatsoever.

His emphasis is on empathy for the people who are affected by the usage of certain terminology. If it's a trivial change we can make to accommodate them, why shouldn't we?

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#164

Post by stnmtn »

throwaway894345 wrote: post #102
throwaheyy wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure I understand the idea of banning words being taken so far. I always interpreted Git’s usage of ‘master’ to mean the original replica. Like the golden master of a record or CD.

Not only this, but the idea that we should focus our efforts on these utter non-problems (no one has ever been harmed or disenfranchised in any way by the use of this term) as opposed to any of the very real problems our society faces (environment, growing inequality, etc) is itself a real problem. And the people who are meant to be the "victims" of these issues almost never take offense or issue (e.g., Japanese opin…

To me this point never makes much sense, do you really believe that a change as small as a naming convention switch means that we can't focus on real problems? It doesn't make sense and is a non-sequitur argument

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#165

Post by Papirola »

zaksoup wrote: post #14
tachyonbeam wrote: post #3

If I say "you are the master of your own destiny", is that offensive, because the word "master" is always offensive? I think that "main branch" sounds fine, it makes as much sense as "master branch", but I'm irked that people are always caving to word policing. Like, we're just going to scratch a whole bunch of words from the dictionary because someone somewhere is offended? The other day, people at my workplace were…

I don’t really get this sentiment. Are you so absolutely dedicated to the phrase “falling on deaf ears” that if somebody says to you “hey, that phrase might hurt somebody’s feelings, can you use an alternative” you take it as some sort of massive imposition on your life? I don’t understand why small changes that can be done in kindness are seen as so inconvenient as to be worth this level of rejection. I’m hearing im…

as a matter of principle, I don't like to be told how/what to think.

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#166

Post by stnmtn »

tachyonbeam wrote: post #117
matthewmacleod wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t understand why small changes that can be done in kindness are seen as so inconvenient as to be worth this level of rejection. I don’t get this either; I’d guess it’s just a personal overreaction. When asked to change something like the language they use to describe something, some people interpret that as an attack. They tend to then overcompensate with a bit of “but I’m not a racist and anyway this is so ins…

> I don’t get this either; I’d guess it’s just a personal overreaction. Maybe some of us frogs can tell the water is slowly getting close to boiling. Maybe we just don't like being bullied and told what to say and think. > master and slave Master as in record, not as in "master and slave". There haven't been "master and slave" IDE hard drives for about 15 years now. FWIW, I would give someone a funny look if they pur…

What do you imagine boiling water looks like, if stuff as small as this is "close to boiling"?

What is the boiling point that we should be so afraid of? I'm genuinely curious to hear what you think we are hurtling towards

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#167

Post by sorokod »

shishy wrote: post #163
sorokod wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you care that in this context the meaning of master is "an original from which copies can be made" or is it irrelevant as you want to have bit of rightous rage?

He said: > Whether this is intentionally "bad" holds no meaning whatsoever. His emphasis is on empathy for the people who are affected by the usage of certain terminology. If it's a trivial change we can make to accommodate them, why shouldn't we?

Because a line should be drawn somewhere.

You use he in "He said", should you not be more careful about your gender assumptions? Are you sure they won't take offense?

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#168

Post by eyelidlessness »

tachyonbeam wrote: post #114
pseudalopex wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Changing a default isn't banning a word. The conference was called NIPS. It's slang for nipples and a racial slur. It isn't like everyone was mature about it. There was an unofficial event called TITS. People wore shirts proclaiming "my NIPS are NP hard". Funny but hardly professional.

> Changing a default isn't banning a word. Yes it is. This change is effectively reflecting a push, by bullies, to ban the word master, to eliminate it from spoken and written language, that's exactly what's happening.

No, it’s not. By changing the default, the majority of people will likely use “main” for new projects because there’s not much incentive to override it besides the attitude you’ve expressed here (and most people are probably not motivated by that attitude), but you’re still free to have that attitude, to use the word, and to override the default trivially.

Language evolves. One of the ways it evolves is that certain expressions become understood as hurtful or impolite... and people with empathy learn to use other expressions in their stead out of respect. That’s not “banning” those expressions, it’s choosing to adapt for the benefit of a broader subset of society.

A great deal of social expectations are the consequence of this kind of process of empathy and adaptation, and they make living on the planet with other people more joyful and safer. Sometimes in small ways, other times in big ways. But you don’t have to meet those expectations if you value the symbolic freedom of using language that’s gone out of vogue for these reasons... you just have to accept that people may view you as inconsiderate as a consequence.

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#169

Post by sputr »

I'm fine with this. It costs me almost nothing, but it means something to some people and I see no reason to block them from getting it.

And its gonna be juuuust a bit easier to explain git to non native speakers who understand 'main' and not 'master'. A bit. Tiny bit.

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