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Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

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Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#81

Post by pininja »

zacwest wrote: post #12

The branch name "master" does not have "golden master" or "master copy" roots: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2019-May/...

This should be the top comment to foster a conversation around sources we can dig up. The digital roots to word usages should be preserved as understanding is the first step to changing. I can’t casually read the bitkeeper “HOWTO” now without cringing at the word choice - it’s not that it didn’t age well, it’s that I used to lack empathy for its usage.

I think treating this human relationship as a light hearted metaphor disregards the gravity of this painful history. Plenty of alternatives exist, and if one doesn’t in someone’s eyes the brilliant thing is new words and meanings can be invented.

I accept criticism of using master/slave as a consequence of the actions taken by citizens in my country in the past. I’m willing to accept responsibility even when my self and family aren’t at fault.

Edit: A second source of word history to review https://econoben.github.io/2020/10/20/master-slave-terminolo...

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#83

Post by pseudalopex »

dtech wrote: post #65
zaksoup wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t really get this sentiment. Are you so absolutely dedicated to the phrase “falling on deaf ears” that if somebody says to you “hey, that phrase might hurt somebody’s feelings, can you use an alternative” you take it as some sort of massive imposition on your life? I don’t understand why small changes that can be done in kindness are seen as so inconvenient as to be worth this level of rejection. I’m hearing im…

I feel for your problems, but I don't think you being hearing impaired gives you a right to be offended at the usage of the word "deaf". It's a functional description, not a slur. I have some similar things which I'd rather not expand upon, but I don't think that gives me the right to be offended at terms unless they are slurs. As a comparison, people shouldn't be offended at any usage of the word "smart", but they'r…

Not being able to hear isn't a functional description of choosing not to listen.

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#84

Post by dspillett »

GhostVII wrote: post #53
PretzelFisch wrote: post #13

If the name change builds a larger, diverse, empathetic community. What have you or I lost?

We haven't lost anything, but we've gained the expectation that we should be accommodating a tiny minority of people being offended for no reason. Sure it's not much work to switch "master" to "main" (although in aggregate it's probably a tonne of person hours), but what happens when the next trend is to be offended at "blacklist", or "sanity check", or any of the other thousands of words that someone is inevitably g…

> "blacklist"

That has already happened in some places, though blacklist/whitelist are still the most common naming convention for that sort of thing.

Blocklist is actually a better name IMO, and I've seen it used in places, and an easy enough change. I don't have any examples I remember of what people might use instead of whitelist though, allowlist doesn't particularly trip of the tongue IMO.

Grandfathering is another common word that I've seen argued against because of its history.

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#85

Post by richard_todd »

zaksoup wrote: post #14
tachyonbeam wrote: post #3

If I say "you are the master of your own destiny", is that offensive, because the word "master" is always offensive? I think that "main branch" sounds fine, it makes as much sense as "master branch", but I'm irked that people are always caving to word policing. Like, we're just going to scratch a whole bunch of words from the dictionary because someone somewhere is offended? The other day, people at my workplace were…

I don’t really get this sentiment. Are you so absolutely dedicated to the phrase “falling on deaf ears” that if somebody says to you “hey, that phrase might hurt somebody’s feelings, can you use an alternative” you take it as some sort of massive imposition on your life? I don’t understand why small changes that can be done in kindness are seen as so inconvenient as to be worth this level of rejection. I’m hearing im…

By your logic, how can you can casually say "walk in my shoes," when you can be sure it bugs people confined to wheelchairs?

Do you owe us all an apology and a promise to never use that common and easily-understood idiom again? I don't think you do... but do you think you do? If not, why not?

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#86

Post by revnode »

bluntfang wrote: post #40
revnode wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're then forced to maintain a fork because of someone else's immaturity. That's not a solution to the problem.

I feel like complaining about a disagreement in direction of an open source project while not wanting to put effort in directing it in the way you like via the normal channels, forking or contribution, to be immature.

I feel like demanding contribution as a response to criticism of open source software is immature. Just because you decided to let everyone see and use your code, doesn't mean someone can't say something negative about it. That is not some sort of privilege reserved for contributors.

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#87

Post by da_big_ghey »

mason55 wrote: post #75
da_big_ghey wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Master/slave has a technical meaning beyond the sense of one person enslaving another. "Nigger" has no use case outside of making horrible and offensive remarks, aside from historical writing (e.g. To Kill a Mockingbird) or making a point about racism, cases in which it is accepted.

So, two things (and I realize you aren't the person I originally replied to). 1. Your argument here is implicitly agreeing with my point number one. There are terms that would be considered too offensive and so the conversation is about where the line falls. We can't just say "let's not ever talk about whether a term is offensive" because there are some that we really wouldn't want to use, and so we should be talking…

My point is that master/slave actually conveys a relationship between two things. It was picked for technical use because of that. Naming something "nigger", even in a technical would do what, offend some other piece of code? If somebody chose an offensive name arbitrarily (like, say, "git"), I would understand the impulse. Though the former is fraught with specific and awful connotations towards a very specific group (American blacks) whereas the latter is simply a general derogatory term (which is tacky, but not unbearably so).

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#88

Post by pseudalopex »

gkoberger wrote: post #55
umvi wrote: post #9

Sigh... sad to see the tech community bullied into compliance over a non-issue by political correctness activists. It's not really that big of a deal (and in some ways "main" is better anyway because it's 2 characters shorter), it's just the principle of the thing that bothers me. I would rather see projects and people stand their ground instead of caving to pressure anytime a twitter mob comes along.

I think, of all the things to come out of BLM, this is one of the easiest to chalk up to “woke culture”. BUT I still support it 100%. What if you had to deal with the worst thing that’s ever happened to your people every time you want to push code at work? No, I don’t think anyone’s out there getting upset every commit, any more than they do walking into Thomas Jefferson High School or seeing a confederate flag on a…

People campaigned to replace master and slave in technology long before BLM.

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#89

Post by gkoberger »

pseudalopex wrote: post #88
gkoberger wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think, of all the things to come out of BLM, this is one of the easiest to chalk up to “woke culture”. BUT I still support it 100%. What if you had to deal with the worst thing that’s ever happened to your people every time you want to push code at work? No, I don’t think anyone’s out there getting upset every commit, any more than they do walking into Thomas Jefferson High School or seeing a confederate flag on a…

People campaigned to replace master and slave in technology long before BLM.

I know, however the change (in Git/GitHub, at least) was never made until now.

Re: Update to Git changes the default of init.defaultBranch to main

#90

Post by s_dev »

mason55 wrote: post #45
denysvitali wrote: post #11

Can we please stop wondering about being politically correct and focus on the real problems of the world? Thanks! I would also like to add the fact that politics or any social matter IMHO should be kept out of software in general. I don't think that any other engineering field has this much drama over some words that have been part of our whole life until now like IT is having.

Imagine if instead of master/slave the terms were master and "n-word". Would there be a reasonable argument to change it at that point? If you say "yes" then you agree there is a line somewhere. If that's the case then we should discuss where the line should be and why it should be there instead of saying "stop [worrying] about being politically correct". If you say "no" then your argument is that no words are too of…

>Imagine if instead of master/slave the terms were master and "n-word".

This is absurd. Hypotheticals are important thinking tools but please don't set the parameters of a discussion to be absurd. No quality content/insight can emerge.

n-word is inherently racist unlike master which has acceptable uses.

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