I've heard of companies planning on paying people less money, since they don't need to commute, buy dress clothes, etc.
"Equal pay for equal work" in remote jobs
211–220 of 624 posts
Re: "Equal pay for equal work" in remote jobs
#212Earlier quoted context omitted.
> then they should not stop that? The whole point of having negotiating power is they can't just "stop" it. Because you, as a union, collectively have enough power to force them to the table to negotiate. Whether or not the company has a problem with unions is basically irrelevant.
It is irrelevant. But somehow companies have convinced most that unions are a bad thing. They have leveraged their greater influence to further their power. They are now in an essentially unassailable position. For the great majority of the workforce they have no bargaining power. This toxic modern world should pop like the noxious little bubble it is. We need a new 60s only this time we need to win.
Unfortunately, I think unions are culpable as well. When they protect bad employees, act to extend their power for it's own sake, refuse to concede despite potentially ruining the company etc. Ironically, they can end up displaying the same qualities they originated to prevent.
Re: "Equal pay for equal work" in remote jobs
#213Earlier quoted context omitted.
Kind of putting the cart before the horse, here. Saying that something is “market price” doesn’t explain anything. Market price is driven by millions of factors including cost of living. “Market price” just means that it’s the price that people actually pay for something in the real world, it’s just a name for that price that doesn’t offer any explanatory power. Cost of living does have explanatory power.
Cost of living is determined by how much people living there are paid, not the other way around.
It’s interconnected. You can’t claim that the relationship goes in one direction.
Re: "Equal pay for equal work" in remote jobs
#214Earlier quoted context omitted.
Kind of putting the cart before the horse, here. Saying that something is “market price” doesn’t explain anything. Market price is driven by millions of factors including cost of living. “Market price” just means that it’s the price that people actually pay for something in the real world, it’s just a name for that price that doesn’t offer any explanatory power. Cost of living does have explanatory power.
But cost of living is only one possible explanation. Desirability also affects it. For example, on the whole, people are willing to spend a greater percent of their income to live in LA vs Dallas. Desirability drives down the market price. Many things go into market price and you don't actually have to pretend to understand them all.
Cost of living is only part of the explanation, but “market price” isn’t even an explanation at all.
Re: "Equal pay for equal work" in remote jobs
#215Earlier quoted context omitted.
Anyone who's ever done an international relocation understands this. It works like this. Your company asks you, a SF-based tech executive, to relocate to India for a three-year assignment. Notional cost of living in India is absurdly low. But your company will actually estimate that you'll need ~$50-100,000 more per year from a COL perspective. This is because your existing lifestyle is now composed of what are all l…
Well, a lot of this isn't about CoL. Having to relocate internationally for a stint imposes all sorts of costs, especially for families. Plus, it's very possible that someone owns a house already which they can maybe rent out but there are still costs involved.
Sure, plus possibly even some element of tax normalization etc.
But these are all cost-of-living items predicated on the assumption "I want to keep on living as I did and not be worse off for it". If that also means international schools for kids so they can stay on the same qualification track, then that's also a necessity, no?
Assistance with costs of home rental are often a separate line item in a good relocation package, and things like shipment of furniture and personal effects, temporary rentals during the initial phase of the move, the services of a local vendor to deal with administrivia are also separate from the cash COL adjustment part.
Re: "Equal pay for equal work" in remote jobs
#216Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm certainly not pro-union in tech, but this is something that could hasten its arrival. Just because I'm in Atlanta doesn't make me inherently worth less than my peers in SF.
> " Just because I'm in Atlanta doesn't make me inherently worth less than my peers in SF. " Should a person be charged SF prices for groceries when they're living in Atlanta because they're getting SF pay? Clearly not. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
> You can't have your cake and eat it too.
You can if you have sufficient negotiating power.
Re: "Equal pay for equal work" in remote jobs
#217Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm certainly not pro-union in tech, but this is something that could hasten its arrival. Just because I'm in Atlanta doesn't make me inherently worth less than my peers in SF.
> " Just because I'm in Atlanta doesn't make me inherently worth less than my peers in SF. " Should a person be charged SF prices for groceries when they're living in Atlanta because they're getting SF pay? Clearly not. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
> Should a person be charged SF prices for groceries when they're living in Atlanta because they're getting SF pay?
Your reasoning makes no sense. It's a choice to live in a city that lets landlords dictate which buildings can be built. Atlanta and other cities are unconstrained for new housing development.
SF policies are a tax on its non-homeowner residents.
You shouldn't be entitled to a differential just because your city doesn't build new housing fast enough. That has no bearing on the work your employees perform.
Re: "Equal pay for equal work" in remote jobs
#218Earlier quoted context omitted.
Overpaid or not (I tend to agree that they are overpaid), if a significant portion of their compensation is stock grants, then that portion of their compensation is directly tied to the value of the company.
I'd argue that the value of the company often doesn't reflect whether they're doing a good job. Which is why you often find CEOs taking short-termist approach which buoys the value of the company in the short term and completely destroys it in the long term.
In 2020 the value of the company largely was driven by the Fed.
Re: "Equal pay for equal work" in remote jobs
#219> You should expect "equal pay for equal work" at your new remote job So naive. In an ideal, utopian world? Maybe it would work this way. Maybe. In reality, your compensation is a function of your negotiating power. Some people, in fact, manage to get the same pay even when working remote, because they're "highly employable". Others don't. And let me add: I almost agree that remote work shouldn't necessarily command…
I’ll add that I once did more critical work as a part timer in college but never achieved equal hourly rate due to the class of worker I was (part time). It’s an age old battle, interns, part time, offshore, etc are always going to be second class citizens.
Feel bad for the prop 22 stuff and gig economy, because they are part of the same struggle. It never ends.
Re: "Equal pay for equal work" in remote jobs
#220Earlier quoted context omitted.
Kind of putting the cart before the horse, here. Saying that something is “market price” doesn’t explain anything. Market price is driven by millions of factors including cost of living. “Market price” just means that it’s the price that people actually pay for something in the real world, it’s just a name for that price that doesn’t offer any explanatory power. Cost of living does have explanatory power.
Cost of living is determined by how much people living there are paid, not the other way around.
> Cost of living is determined by how much people living there are paid, not the other way around.
Cost of living affects the supply side of labor pricing.
Wages affect the demand side of cost of living.
Neither is determined solely by the other, but each influences the other.