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Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

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Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#331

Post by Mindwipe »

macinjosh wrote: post #320
kmeisthax wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Provide an officially-sanctioned way to install alternative software sources. macOS has that; Apple will even certify third party developers so that the system can still validate software outside of the Mac App Store. That kind of security model would be perfect for iOS and would moot pretty much all the substantive parts of Epic's complaint.

Just because it is something YOU want doesn't mean we ALL want it. I appreciate Apple's review of apps and their store policies. While no human endeavor is perfect it is at least an attempt to keep their platform more secure, safer for kids, higher quality, and more trustworthy. Opening up the platform to other app stores means they have less control over the experience on their platform it opens more avenues for mal…

Safer for kids who aren't in Hong Kong, presumably.

A single source of application signing will always be abused to entrench dangerous governments and prejudice. It is toxic, and needs to be outlawed.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#332

Post by beagle3 »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #284
pja wrote: post #173

I’m seeing a lot of positive comments on HN about this: to me it seems to be purely a cynical piece of PR on Apple’s part. They hope to significantly reduce the pressure on politicians to take a close look at their App store practices by significantly reducing the absolute number of developers suffering the full impact whilst taking the minimum possible hit to their revenue. This has nothing to do with “doing the rig…

> significantly reducing the absolute number of developers suffering the full impact whilst taking the minimum possible hit to their revenue It also reduces their anti-competitive effect on new entrants. Now they have a beachhead. Sounds like a win-win. There should be an additional tier between e.g. $1mm and $25mm. Though that still wouldn't satisfy an absolutist constituency. So maybe this is the most efficient com…

It has zero effect on Epic’s bottom line, but a potentially huge effect on their lawsuit - they were portraying themselves in the media, and likely the lawsuit as well, as “fighting for everyone, especially the little guys”. All of a sudden, they are left fighting for the fat cats.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#333

Post by satya71 »

graeme wrote: post #296
kqvamxurcagg wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have to agree you. It's intolerable that Apple has been allowed to lockdown their device for 10 years, completely control the market for apps and when it looks like regulators will take action they reduce their price and claim to be acting in the interest of small business. Third party app stores must be allowed. Apple should not be allowed to dictate what software I can and cannot have on my device.

Why not get another device? Third party app stores break the security model for regular users. Smartphones have seen explosive growth because normal people can use them safely.

I don't think it breaks the security model. There could be a strict but fair standard for qualifying as an app store. Then I could choose an app store that imposes an even stricter security/privacy model.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#334

Post by leadingthenet »

coder543 wrote: post #243
cwhiz wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn’t a problem exclusive to Apple anymore. Google has implemented some draconian nonsense this year to the point where I ended up distributing my Android app as a PWA. I had no problems with Apple. Apple gets all the headlines, and certainly gets more chatter on HN, but they aren’t alone in this bullshit. As an example... Fortnite was also banned by Google.

I really, really wish that Apple would support push notifications for PWAs that have been added to the home screen. Without push notifications, PWAs are not really viable and Apple knows it. Apple wants developers to use the App Store and be subject to their fees and review process. At least Google supports push notifications for PWAs, making them a legitimate alternative on Android.

> Apple wants developers to use the App Store and be subject to their fees and review process.

As do I, an end-user of Apple's platforms.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#335

Post by ho_schi »

Apple? You want do something for developers? Open up iOS because it is actually an all-purpose computer system for the pocket and not an appliance.

800 Euro for the smallest iPhone? Well, that is incredible much. Okay Apple provides reliable upgrades and updates. And then you beat out 30% of 2 Euro for a small application out from a developer? Wow. That's capitalistic greed. Aside from that Apple earned already money with selling an expensive Mac to the developer at minimum and another 100 $ for the developer access.

And all of that after Trump has allowed you to legalize all earnings for which Apple didn't payed taxes. It's incredible how a company like Apple still plays the role of "the good hip guys company".

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#336

Post by coder543 »

leadingthenet wrote: post #334
coder543 wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really, really wish that Apple would support push notifications for PWAs that have been added to the home screen. Without push notifications, PWAs are not really viable and Apple knows it. Apple wants developers to use the App Store and be subject to their fees and review process. At least Google supports push notifications for PWAs, making them a legitimate alternative on Android.

> Apple wants developers to use the App Store and be subject to their fees and review process. As do I, an end-user of Apple's platforms.

You’re welcome to use App Store apps... I don’t see the problem.

Safari PWAs protect your privacy better than native apps, because Safari trusts no one. The App Store review process is trying to find a malicious needle in a haystack because iOS by default trusts native apps more than it should, due to the existence of that nebulous review process. Apple is slowly locking down native apps with each successive iOS version... but PWAs have always been extremely private, and they're still the gold standard as far as I've seen.

PWAs are actually completely isolated from each other and from the rest of Safari, so there is no cross-contamination for tracking purposes.

If you don’t want more choice and more privacy... that’s up to you. I really don’t know what to tell you.

PWAs aren't the "wild west" that sideloading apps would be, yet you're trying to use the classic anti-sideloading argument against PWAs, and that argument simply doesn't work here. Apple has supported PWAs since before there was even an Apple App Store for native apps!

PWAs already exist, and PWAs are already extremely private. Apple just needs to give PWAs push notification support. Users would still have complete control over notifications, just like any native app.

Apple heavily pushes native apps because of the profit they get from it, not because of concerns about user privacy. They have already built Safari to protect your privacy on the open web.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#337

Post by maxsilver »

pja wrote: post #173

I’m seeing a lot of positive comments on HN about this: to me it seems to be purely a cynical piece of PR on Apple’s part. They hope to significantly reduce the pressure on politicians to take a close look at their App store practices by significantly reducing the absolute number of developers suffering the full impact whilst taking the minimum possible hit to their revenue. This has nothing to do with “doing the rig…

Agreed. And it's frustrating to see most people getting tricked this easily.

In the old days, when telecommunications devices and networks were getting monopolized like this, we'd break the company up into smaller entities, and then regulate the hell out of them, especially on monopolized/duopolized prices.

In a just world, Apple would never be allowed to set the app store tax at all, a group of state or federal regulators would have strict price caps set by the public at large and enforced by state or federal law. (This is how many places still handle Electricity and Natural Gas. This is approximately what we did to AT&T, when they tried this same crap).

If you own a monopoly/duopoly, you should expect to be heavily regulated like one. If you don't like that, stop monopolizing that market. This isn't rocket science, it's the conservative position on this issue.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#338

Post by redwall_hp »

pier25 wrote: post #293

This doesn't change much. PWAs are still second-class citizens on iOS. Still no third party browser engines. Apple can reject your app for whatever reason and everything you've invested into producing iOS code vanishes into thin air.

It was only a few months ago that the Hey thing happened, and that was all over HN. You can run a business entirely unrelated to iOS, release an iOS app because your users expect it, and then Apple comes in and starts making demands that you change your business model...

Seriously, that's entirely unacceptable.

And the Spotify and Amazon issue is textbook antitrust. Amazon won't sell ebooks on iOS devices because Apple will take 30%, which is too much for Amazon's commission structure. Apple also sells ebooks. Spotify has offered a music streaming service for years, and Apple demands 30% of every month's payment if purchased through iOS...and now Apple offers a competing service at the same price point.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#340

Post by mrtksn »

sercand wrote: post #152
gtsteve wrote: post #21

Looks nice but it doesn't solve my fundamental problem: 1. I invest loads of time and effort developing an app 2. Apple rejects it -or- 2. Apple approves it 3. I ship a new update 4. Apple rejects the update and now decides my app should have been rejected retroactively. I'm especially concerned about what happened to Hey and others but my customers are demanding smartphone apps and there are still limits to what can…

At least review process is better than Google's because when we rejected on Play Store we can't get any feedback from Google. They send a template email which says the "problem maybe A or B, check what you have changed". Apple provides screenshots and human written explanation on rejection. I have even talked on the phone with review team several times to discuss the problem. Yes, it sucks that the update may be reje…

Apple's human touch is underrated and I feel like those who complain about Apple's review process have no real world experience and talking from ideological standpoint.

I was more than glad to receive a f..g phone call from the reviewer telling me why he will reject my update, why is it this way and what I can do to make it pass and give me his phone number to call if I need further assistance.

I become die hard Apple AppStore review process fanboy by getting a rejection!

You know what happens when you get a rejection from some other place? You get a template e-mail with no specifics, good luck figure it out. Tough luck if your livelihood depends on it.

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