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I take illegal drugs for inspiration

susanblackmore.co.uk

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Re: I take illegal drugs for inspiration

#21

Post by 5l »

melvinram wrote: post #11

I just don't buy it. IMHO, saying that using drugs to get to ideas/inspiration is like saying a wheelchair can help you get from one place to another even though your limbs are perfectly adequate. Maybe it'll help you get here but you could have gotten there without it. If you like to get high, don't make excuses for it. Just admit to yourself that you like to get high. People who like to go to strip clubs don't say…

Well I do think you're completely wrong anyway, but actually I hear plenty of people say they watch TV for the news and documentaries, and I hear plenty of anecdotes about guys going to strip clubs or hiring prostitutes because they're lonely.

People are different

Re: I take illegal drugs for inspiration

#22

Post by ltemp »

araneae wrote: post #5
ltemp wrote: post #4

Throwaway account. Taking LSD has been one of the most powerful experiences of my life - same level of power as one of my children dying. The first time I took it (rather late in life), it saved my marriage. After the intense trippy part died down, I was able to introspect from other people's viewpoints in a way I was never able to before. I could actually see I was the one being the ass, not the other way around. Th…

>same level of power as one of my children dying. See, that's terrifying to me. I've never taken LSD but I don't think I would ever want to put myself in the sort of situation that trivializes the death of a child by making it equivalent to downing a pill. This talk of using MDMA for couples' therapy because it releases vasopressin scares me too. Vasopressin is the bonding hormone, and sure, you could probably make t…

Forgive me, I did not clearly explain that. It does not trivialise the death of my child in any way. Having my first daughter dying was one of the worst things that ever happened to me. It slowly, but totally changed my life. Emotionally, I just hardened up. My outlook on life changed (realising the one chance to live, life is precious, enjoy every second, etc. etc.).

The other horrible event in my life was a series of severe panic/psychosis attacks. I stood next to my girlfriend, and truly did not know if I was me, if she was anybody, if I was an alien, or what. And then it was just a feeling of "absolute terror". You're utterly and completely terrified - no "reason", just a total sensation of dread. I would have cut my legs off if it would have stopped it. (BTW, this was all before I tried LSD.)

So, when I say "powerful", I mean, reflecting back on my life, looking at the events that stand out, that truly had an impact, that are "amazing" - what would those be? In no particular order:

  - The birth of my children (the first time I almost fainted, not from the blood but just from sheer awesomeness of holding her in my arms).

  - The loss of my first child (when the doctor shook his head, I just collapsed, not to mention the effects for years to come).

  - Panic attacks

  - Some of the times my wife and I have made love.

  - LSD: Even just the experience, let alone the impact on my life.
In other words, it's a "lifetime experience".

Re: I take illegal drugs for inspiration

#23

Post by araneae »

Alex3917 wrote: post #16
araneae wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>same level of power as one of my children dying. See, that's terrifying to me. I've never taken LSD but I don't think I would ever want to put myself in the sort of situation that trivializes the death of a child by making it equivalent to downing a pill. This talk of using MDMA for couples' therapy because it releases vasopressin scares me too. Vasopressin is the bonding hormone, and sure, you could probably make t…

"I'm not sure I would want to be married to someone I could only stand because I took drugs." That's not how it works. The drugs allow you to explore feelings that you're otherwise not able to explore, and work through whatever emotional roadblocks you're having with your partner. Essentially it lets you find the source of your anxiety and problems, when normally you'd just be really anxious and unhappy all the time…

>That's not how it works.

How do you know how it works? It's possible it doesn't, but release of vasopressin in the brain is responsible for bonding behavior i.e. http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v365/n6446/abs/365545a0...

On the other hand, there's no evidence for all this "exploring feelings" stuff.

Re: I take illegal drugs for inspiration

#24

Post by araneae »

radu_floricica wrote: post #13
araneae wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>same level of power as one of my children dying. See, that's terrifying to me. I've never taken LSD but I don't think I would ever want to put myself in the sort of situation that trivializes the death of a child by making it equivalent to downing a pill. This talk of using MDMA for couples' therapy because it releases vasopressin scares me too. Vasopressin is the bonding hormone, and sure, you could probably make t…

The death of your own child even, not just any child. Just a thought: can you imagine that there may be many completely different ways you could think, all of them "sane"? That the patterns of thought you take for granted are mostly there by chance? Please take a moment and think before you answer. Because if you can't, that would explain your reaction. GP found out something about himself by using LSD, and that some…

The analogy about penicillin is quite silly, because LSD didn't save this guy's life- it didn't do anything tangible- it was a mental experience disconnected from reality... whereas the death of his child was real. If the pill brought the kid back to life I wouldn't be criticizing it.

Re: I take illegal drugs for inspiration

#25

Post by oinksoft »

As somebody who has smoked pounds...this tripe gets tired quickly. Any effort towards legalization must focus not on broad social acceptance (by representing ganja as some holy, enlightening agent) but rather on analysis of the terrible damage prohibition does to society. Writing of this sort is very snooty towards casual smokers who honestly just want to get high, which should be as acceptable as any other use.

Re: I take illegal drugs for inspiration

#26

Post by sigil »

For both individuals and society, all drugs present a dilemma: are they worth the risks to health, wealth and sanity? For me, the pay-off is the scientific inspiration, the wealth of new ideas and the spur to inner exploration.

The most prolific mathematician of all time, Paul Erdős, justified his amphetamine usage in similar terms [1]:

"After 1971 he also took amphetamines, despite the concern of his friends, one of whom (Ron Graham) bet him $500 that he could not stop taking the drug for a month. Erdős won the bet, but complained that during his abstinence mathematics had been set back by a month: 'Before, when I looked at a piece of blank paper my mind was filled with ideas. Now all I see is a blank piece of paper.' After he won the bet, he promptly resumed his amphetamine use."

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Erd%C5%91s

Re: I take illegal drugs for inspiration

#27

Post by jwuphysics »

CoryMathews wrote: post #2

"The drugs can take you up in a helicopter to see what's there, but you can't stay. In the end, you have to climb the mountain yourself - the hard way." Thats a really good way to put it.

Having done many of the ones listed in the article, I would like to throw in my two cents:

Drugs, like LSD or DMT, are not at all like seeing things from a helicopter. Sure, they are from a "new perspective", but unfortunately it's all in your head. My closest analogy is to dreaming--it seems to make perfect sense when you're dreaming, but when you wake up, you realize that all your thoughts were nonsense. I've had high ideas before. The feeling of revelation is unparalleled... even if it's all in my head. Once I sober up, though, I suddenly realize that they're a load of crap.

Rather being a helicopter to check out what's up there, drugs more so resemble staring out the window and pretending to visualize things past the horizon. You don't come to your senses until you realize it's all in your head.

I've quit them all now and honestly I only miss acid from time to time. But the fact that it's just eight hours of false epiphanies makes sure that I don't care to ever trip again.

Re: I take illegal drugs for inspiration

#28

Post by araneae »

jonknee wrote: post #7
araneae wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>same level of power as one of my children dying. See, that's terrifying to me. I've never taken LSD but I don't think I would ever want to put myself in the sort of situation that trivializes the death of a child by making it equivalent to downing a pill. This talk of using MDMA for couples' therapy because it releases vasopressin scares me too. Vasopressin is the bonding hormone, and sure, you could probably make t…

> See, that's terrifying to me. I've never taken LSD but I don't think I would ever want to put myself in the sort of situation that trivializes the death of a child by making it equivalent to downing a pill. Maybe we just read it differently (hopefully the OP will step in), but I don't think he meant LSD trivialized the death of his child in any way. I think he meant that looking back, LSD had a similarly profound i…

The difference is that losing a child gives you real information about your surroundings. Taking LSD doesn't allow you to take in any different input- it simply changes the way your brain interprets that same information. I can see why people would enjoy this, but not how they could take it seriously. Taking drugs breaks the way your brain is supposed to function; I mean that quite literally.

I mean, if I introduced bugs into my simulation code and got results that I liked, I'd be like, "I need to fix those bugs" not "boy are these great results! Look, I can stop the HIV epidemic!" Because I'd be wrong.

Re: I take illegal drugs for inspiration

#29

Post by pkennedy »

lell wrote: post #3

I read her text book 'introduction to consciousness' in a fourth year course in cognitive science. Probably the reason she was able to study parapsychology early in her career was that it was during the cold war when there were branches of the US government that took ESP seriously, and wanted to prove and exploit or disprove it before the soviets. But her rejection of parapsychology was pretty complete, and that text…

A recent edition I read a couple months ago mentioned it in a sidebar, as a personal anecdote. But it was mainly about her realization that the scientific methods of her colleagues were rather less sound than they at first appeared.

edit: in light of this: http://www.susanblackmore.co.uk/journalism/NS2000.html I'd have to agree that the coverage of the matter in the book was rather insufficient.

Re: I take illegal drugs for inspiration

#30

Post by Cushman »

araneae wrote: post #5
ltemp wrote: post #4

Throwaway account. Taking LSD has been one of the most powerful experiences of my life - same level of power as one of my children dying. The first time I took it (rather late in life), it saved my marriage. After the intense trippy part died down, I was able to introspect from other people's viewpoints in a way I was never able to before. I could actually see I was the one being the ass, not the other way around. Th…

>same level of power as one of my children dying. See, that's terrifying to me. I've never taken LSD but I don't think I would ever want to put myself in the sort of situation that trivializes the death of a child by making it equivalent to downing a pill. This talk of using MDMA for couples' therapy because it releases vasopressin scares me too. Vasopressin is the bonding hormone, and sure, you could probably make t…

Do you feel the same way about "natural" sources of vasopressin, i.e. sex?

Like it or not, if you're in a relationship you are taking drugs.

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