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Empathy and perspective taking: How social skills are built

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Re: Empathy and perspective taking: How social skills are built

#31

Post by bigbubba »

motohagiography wrote: post #27

Can you empathize with genius beyond your comrehension, or is this just a downward relationship, and does doing so make you a peer? Can you empathize with objective evils like sadism or cruelty without becoming a party to it? It raises the question of what it is, really. The popular emphasis on empathy seems to reduce to a secular political idea, where the more traditional value of compassion is more of a theological…

> Can you empathize with genius beyond your comrehension

Yes. A 'genius beyond your comprehension' is still a human and will have some experiences that other humans can relate to. Being smart doesn't make you a space alien.

Re: Empathy and perspective taking: How social skills are built

#32

Post by rectang »

motohagiography wrote: post #27

Can you empathize with genius beyond your comrehension, or is this just a downward relationship, and does doing so make you a peer? Can you empathize with objective evils like sadism or cruelty without becoming a party to it? It raises the question of what it is, really. The popular emphasis on empathy seems to reduce to a secular political idea, where the more traditional value of compassion is more of a theological…

Honestly, I'll take either empathy or compassion. We need more of both.

Re: Empathy and perspective taking: How social skills are built

#33

Post by _jy3k »

"Being able to feel empathy and to take in the other person's perspective – these are two abilities through which we understand what is going on in the other person's mind."

How about being able to feel oneself and take one's own perspective, for a change. What a strange world, where every one takes someone else's perspective.

Re: Empathy and perspective taking: How social skills are built

#34

Post by jcims »

bigbubba wrote: post #31
motohagiography wrote: post #27

Can you empathize with genius beyond your comrehension, or is this just a downward relationship, and does doing so make you a peer? Can you empathize with objective evils like sadism or cruelty without becoming a party to it? It raises the question of what it is, really. The popular emphasis on empathy seems to reduce to a secular political idea, where the more traditional value of compassion is more of a theological…

> Can you empathize with genius beyond your comrehension Yes. A 'genius beyond your comprehension' is still a human and will have some experiences that other humans can relate to. Being smart doesn't make you a space alien.

>'genius beyond your comprehension' is still a human

For now. Aliens and AGI might complicate that.

Re: Empathy and perspective taking: How social skills are built

#35

Post by snazz »

_jy3k wrote: post #33

"Being able to feel empathy and to take in the other person's perspective – these are two abilities through which we understand what is going on in the other person's mind." How about being able to feel oneself and take one's own perspective, for a change. What a strange world, where every one takes someone else's perspective.

Humans are pretty good at taking our own perspectives. If everyone did that instead of empathizing with others, our conversations would all run in circles and we would be an even more polarized society.

Re: Empathy and perspective taking: How social skills are built

#36

Post by bigbubba »

BurningFrog wrote: post #29
bluedino wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve taken these classes and it comes down to “be someone you aren’t in order to make conversation” It just feels so fake and scripted. I can easily tell in a business setting when people are just putting on their Dale Carnegie hat.

You can also think of it as "make an effort to act in a way others enjoy".

I don't enjoy the superficiality of a sleezeball who took courses in 'pretending to care.' But for each their own I suppose.

Re: Empathy and perspective taking: How social skills are built

#37

Post by ravenstine »

rectang wrote: post #4

What I'm most interested in is to to what degree the lack of "facial expressions", "speech melody" and the like in internet communication impedes the development of empathy. We can communicate with more people than ever before, but our ability to empathize with those people is poor.

I'm not convinced that empathy is developed in adulthood.

Re: Empathy and perspective taking: How social skills are built

#38

Post by awinder »

motohagiography wrote: post #27

Can you empathize with genius beyond your comrehension, or is this just a downward relationship, and does doing so make you a peer? Can you empathize with objective evils like sadism or cruelty without becoming a party to it? It raises the question of what it is, really. The popular emphasis on empathy seems to reduce to a secular political idea, where the more traditional value of compassion is more of a theological…

The first part of this is kinda funny. The problem is that you’re squinting too hard to try to make out the problem and now everything is fuzzy. The real value of empathy — why we’ve been using this social tool for thousands of years — is that you don’t have to become the actor to gain understanding. This tool also has a learning aspect, usually you try to empathize with people who you’re gonna be around a bit, so while you may not be able to check an empathy box right away, you could use empathy to further understand genius than you could without it.

Re: Empathy and perspective taking: How social skills are built

#39

Post by bigbubba »

throwaway_pdp09 wrote: post #25
jungletime wrote: post #20

A good related book is "How to win Friends and Influence people". Basically its a guide how to make friends, with a realization that we live in a world full of selfish people, that are self centered and don't have much empathy. This is the default state of human beings. I watched an interview with Pol Pot and even he thought of himself as a good guy. Quick Book Summary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qvUYtwASqY Pol…

While it may be true that there are many selfish people, many aren't. Interpret the world as being packed with wankers and in your mind you deny people the chance to be anything else. I had a relative like that, he wasn't a nice person.

As the saying goes, a thief thinks every man steals. I am very wary of people who are deeply pessimistic in the what they believe about everybody else.

Re: Empathy and perspective taking: How social skills are built

#40

Post by bigbubba »

jcims wrote: post #34
bigbubba wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can you empathize with genius beyond your comrehension Yes. A 'genius beyond your comprehension' is still a human and will have some experiences that other humans can relate to. Being smart doesn't make you a space alien.

>'genius beyond your comprehension' is still a human For now. Aliens and AGI might complicate that.

We can cross that road when we come to it.
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