Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Gig economy companies spent more than $200M to bankroll Proposition 22

theguardian.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

121–130 of 401 posts

Re: Gig economy companies spent more than $200M to bankroll Proposition 22

#121

Post by Jommi »

kemiller2002 wrote: post #67
rectang wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I drove for Lyft for a while while taking a break from software. Then I got t-boned by a red-light runner. Fortunately no one was injured. I was on my way to pick up a passenger, but it was only me in the vehicle. When I went to make my insurance claim to fix several thousand dollars worth of damage to my car, I discovered that despite having done a lot of research when trying to buy the right insurance with a ridesh…

I think this is the key statement to all of this. No one thinks about the risk. Running a business, which in a sense you are doing by being a contractor, is all about managing risk. When I ran a food business, that was 90% of my tasks, and I had to make sure that things continued to run no matter what happened. When you start realizing how exposed you are to bad things happening, it starts to wear on you. What happen…

This is a terrible argument. If every single small thing that could happen to you was explained to you before you made any decision, I can guarantee you would never make any new decisions.

Re: Gig economy companies spent more than $200M to bankroll Proposition 22

#122

Post by treeman79 »

wavepruner wrote: post #72
esrauch wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm confused by the "needed money for healthcare that would never be covered by universal insurance", are you sure such costs wouldn't be covered by NHS or similar had you lived in another country?

No, the treatments I need are experimental, and there is a tremendous amount of hostility from healthcare workers directed at people with my illness. It is very controversial. Europeans are just as fucked as Americans when they have this illness.

Simple migraines fall into this category.

Umm I can’t see, walk straight, or think normally 4-5 days a weeks. Disability, your faking it. Doctor, it can’t possibly be that bad, your lying.

Re: Gig economy companies spent more than $200M to bankroll Proposition 22

#123

Post by Finnucane »

yohannparis wrote: post #19
NovemberWhiskey wrote: post #14

Alternative spin, same facts: "voters undo unpopular overreach by state government".

That's the point of a government. Every law is an overreach by the government.

How are things down in the bunker?

Re: Gig economy companies spent more than $200M to bankroll Proposition 22

#124

Post by Jommi »

yohannparis wrote: post #24
treeman79 wrote: post #18

Got injured awhile back. Disability decided to play hardball. Gig jobs are all that kept family off the street while I recovered. Starting and stopping anytime as my body could tolerate. Or renting out rooms on Airbnb. Sometimes it took me 4 hours to change sheets and tidy up, but it made the difference. Not saying their good companies. But gigs was crazy valuable to me.

The issue is not the gig economy but businesses that force rules and behaviours (when to work, which client, you cannot refuse jobs, etc.) without labour protection. Either you are a platform that connects you to a potential client (like a powerful yellow page), or you are an employer.

And where does the line go?

Re: Gig economy companies spent more than $200M to bankroll Proposition 22

#125

Post by JamesBarney »

rectang wrote: post #47
treeman79 wrote: post #18

Got injured awhile back. Disability decided to play hardball. Gig jobs are all that kept family off the street while I recovered. Starting and stopping anytime as my body could tolerate. Or renting out rooms on Airbnb. Sometimes it took me 4 hours to change sheets and tidy up, but it made the difference. Not saying their good companies. But gigs was crazy valuable to me.

I drove for Lyft for a while while taking a break from software. Then I got t-boned by a red-light runner. Fortunately no one was injured. I was on my way to pick up a passenger, but it was only me in the vehicle. When I went to make my insurance claim to fix several thousand dollars worth of damage to my car, I discovered that despite having done a lot of research when trying to buy the right insurance with a ridesh…

If the law had been more narrowly tailored to making ride shares responsible for work accidents I think you'd see a lot more support for the law.

Re: Gig economy companies spent more than $200M to bankroll Proposition 22

#126

Post by colejohnson66 »

tasuki wrote: post #111

> The company, along with Lyft and DoorDash, spent more than $200m to deny drivers the wages and benefits we’re entitled to I wonder, why does the author think they're entitled to wages and benefits beyond what they agreed to? I'd understand the sentiment a little more if Uber was wildly profitable, but it isn't. If Uber isn't treating the drivers right, they don't have to drive for Uber. Or they can go and try to ch…

> Or they can go and try to change the laws and regulations to be more fair.

Wasn’t that the whole point of AB5? To change the law so Uber/Lyft drivers are paid what they deserve?

Re: Gig economy companies spent more than $200M to bankroll Proposition 22

#127

Post by dannyw »

tasuki wrote: post #111

> The company, along with Lyft and DoorDash, spent more than $200m to deny drivers the wages and benefits we’re entitled to I wonder, why does the author think they're entitled to wages and benefits beyond what they agreed to? I'd understand the sentiment a little more if Uber was wildly profitable, but it isn't. If Uber isn't treating the drivers right, they don't have to drive for Uber. Or they can go and try to ch…

All regulation and 'labor protection' does is accelerate the investment and transition into an AI anyway.

Re: Gig economy companies spent more than $200M to bankroll Proposition 22

#128

Post by x3ro »

greggyb wrote: post #81
x3ro wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe I'm too left-leaning, but doesn't it feel wrong to deny people the possibility of seeing a doctor, calling in sick if they don't feel good or earning enough money to afford more than Ramen at the end of the month, no matter their line of work? It's great that the HN crowd is primarily privileged from an income point of view, but I find it hard to fathom that people lose sight of the fact that not everyone is th…

> Maybe I'm too left-leaning, but doesn't it feel wrong to deny people the possibility of seeing a doctor, calling in sick if they don't feel good or earning enough money to afford more than Ramen at the end of the month, no matter their line of work? It does feel wrong to deny people the possibility of seeing a doctor. It does feel wrong that some people can't afford basic necessities. Why do you insist on drawing a…

I fully agree with you. In a society where people would not have any existential fears, employed or not, Uber would not get away with what they're doing anyway. But I think the argument is orthogonal to what I meant.

In context of the system that Uber drivers are living in right now, Prop22 is a step in the wrong direction: it gives affirmation to companies that actively deprives gig workers of the rights we talk about above.

Of course it'd be better to solve this problem at a higher level, but I'm happy to argue against proponents of steps in the wrong direction (e.g. Prop22).

Re: Gig economy companies spent more than $200M to bankroll Proposition 22

#129

Post by moduspol »

MattGaiser wrote: post #117
moduspol wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For real. My exposure to California news is basically just what I see on HN and anything that hits national headlines. I had no idea Californians would vote for something like this. Kind of makes you wonder how large the disconnect is between what we see in the media and what people actually think.

I suspect it is a pocketbook issue. Californians don’t want to pay more for transport and food delivery. Political ideals often give way to cheaper goods.

Maybe. Maybe Californians just aren't actually buying the "oppressed rideshare driver" narrative as much as we've been led to believe.

Re: Gig economy companies spent more than $200M to bankroll Proposition 22

#130

Post by gowld »

ericabiz wrote: post #51

My husband drives for Uber, and I’m glad the proposition passed as it is. He drives the way Uber was originally envisioned. He goes out some nights if there’s a surge, and in the morning on the way to work he points the app toward our stores and grabs a person (pre-pandemic) or a food delivery (today) on his way in. It pays for gas money, car maintenance, and then some. Some months he makes a few hundred dollars. Som…

How would the AB5 law without 22 hurt him? What's wrong with part-time employment?

Why is someone's beer money more important than someone else's full time subsistence?

Post reply on HN