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Your Computer Isn't Yours

sneak.berlin

461–470 of 764 posts

Re: Your Computer Isn't Yours

#461
post #396

There’s a rather strong counter to this is: I, and the vast majority of computer users, don’t want to manage every nitty-gritty detail of the security and privacy of my computer. I have better things to do. In fact, doing it fully competently is more than a full time job. So farming this out to a third-party is a necessity, for me and many, many others. Of course, it’s not perfect. How much can I trust the third part…

While I disagree that this is a strong counter, it does explain how this has happened.

People are lazy. They want their computer to show them pictures on Facebook, funny videos online and run some numbers for them. People don't want to care about stuff like privacy, because thinking gets in the way of fun and ease.

Malware has already bypassed Apple's signature mechanism and has been vetted to run by Apple as a result. The security and trust argument only works if Apple's security mechanisms work.

The vetting Apple is doing here is a solution looking for a problem. People have been installing third party applications forever, the ability to do so is a feature, not a bug. Instead of fixing the lacking antivirus software built into macOS, Apple is branding third party code as dangerous and untrustworthy.

I don't know anybody who cares about the problem this is solving, because it's a theoretical problem only tech literate people care about; the same tech literate people are also the people who run into this stuff the most. The reason that no one is offering a better solution is that there isn't a real problem that this solution is solving.

Re: Your Computer Isn't Yours

#463
post #332
post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mac users can already add any certificate to the Apple keychain and authorize them for code signing. The outage today, which what was being written about in the article, was caused by the OCSP.APPLE.COM service not responding. The OCSP service was likely being used to validate if an Apple Developer certificate was still valid. Operating a "trusted" Certificate Authority generally requires operating under some rules.…

Actually, Firefox is going to start sending a CRL 4x daily in lieu of OCSP. Chrome hasn't supported OCSP since 2012, and publishes CRLSets instead. OCSP is considered bad by at least Chrome and Firefox due to leaking side channel information in exactly the way the article describes. https://blog.mozilla.org/security/2020/01/21/crlite-part-3-s... https://www.imperialviolet.org/2012/02/05/crlsets.html

And for websites, there's a better way to do OCSP. The web server using the certificate can get an OCSP response for itself (usually once every few minutes) and attach it to all TLS handshakes for that same domain ("OCSP stapling"). That way, clients get an up-to-date OCSP response, but without having to reveal their browsing behavior to the OCSP server.

Unfortunately, there is no obvious way to carry over this behavior to application binaries, since we're not dealing with a client-server architecture here.

Re: Your Computer Isn't Yours

#464
being a devils advocate- isn't this a beta still for the very reason? I'm not sure Apple itself wants to be a developer unfriendly and everyone monitoring company + unencrypted traffic looks like something quick and dirty (analytics about beta users and issues?)

Maybe let's get an Apple's response first on these issues? It's not these issues and implications are small, but shouting from very beginning is not a good way to start a reasonable discussion whether this is a beta feature or something apple now will include permanently and why.

Re: Your Computer Isn't Yours

#465

Earlier quoted context omitted.

10 years ago when I started working I feared the younger generation and their enthusiasm and energy. Then I had to teach a few of them how to ssh and that fear was dissolved. Most of these kids will not cut it in heavy reading/comprehension jobs.

As an "older" coder I get where your hinting at but your view on Zoomers in tech from your high horse seems very narrow and entitled. I'm sure there are Zoomers out there who can code rings around you(and me).

I think the parent just meant the surprise at the lack of enthusiasm, based on the ubiquity of the technology/device.

Perhaps it is considered more of a commodity now?

Re: Your Computer Isn't Yours

#466

Quote: "These machines are the first general purpose computers ever where you have to make an exclusive choice: you can have a fast and efficient machine, or you can have a private one." I call BS on Apple having the fastest machine, even at current moment, not to mention in the future. I can make a gaming rig with latest Ryzen CPU that will run whatever I want and be both faster and cheaper than Apple's expensive cr…

> I can make a gaming rig with latest Ryzen CPU that will run whatever I want and be both faster and cheaper than Apple's expensive crap.

No you can not. The M1 chip has the fastest single-core performance of any consumer chip available today, beating every chip in AMD’s brand-new Zen 3 lineup. You can get faster multi-core performance (5950X) but definitely not foe the same price as Apple’s new computers - not to mention the massive power draw and much worse thermals in comparison.

Re: Your Computer Isn't Yours

#467
post #294
post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I worry for Gen Z because they're tiny-mobile-device native. And the only usable tiny mobile devices are walled gardens. Without the ability to grow up playing with system level software, combined with the software industry's unwillingness to pass on institutional knowledge to younger generations, I fear we are already on a path towards a civilization that loses a lot of the technological capability we currently en…

Gen Z can get real general-purpose computers with a development environment for cheap. The new Raspberry Pi 400 is a modern take on home computers like the C64, but 15 times cheaper. Pi 400 full kit: $100, C64: $595 (1982) / $1576 (inflation adjusted for 2019). The computers are not just getting cheaper, educative material is easier than ever to find. Because modern computers are much more complex and do much more th…

> The new Raspberry Pi 400

Learning about the Raspberry Pi is nice, but that doesn't help preserve the institutional knowledge needed to build system/low-level features in a modern OS. I'm not talking about teaching kids to program; I'm concerned about preserving in the future the knowledge of how to create all of the complex tech we use today. Many civilizations throughout history collapsed after they lost the technical knowledge on which their civilization depended.

> Because modern computers are much more complex and do much more than before, you don't do much bare metal programming anymore

Yes, that's the problem! Unless those skills are actively used and passed on to the next generation of engineers, that knowledge decays. Part of the reason you don't see a lot of bare metal programming anymore is due to the knowledge decay that has already happened!

> nothing is stopping a kid from buying a microcontroller and playing with it

This article is about how those same kids are being stopped from learning the complex systems we currently use.

> didn't turn everyone into a nerd.

Nobody is trying to turn everyone into a nerd. I'm talking about making sure the nerds of he future have the ability to learn about the tech they use, so the ability to understand and make that tech isn't lost. Locking down the OS into an "appliance" that cannot be inspected or changed is a direct attack on the ability to learn,

Re: Your Computer Isn't Yours

#468

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Have you really used a desktop Linux desktop recently? Someone has to say this literally any time someone mentions problems with Linux Desktop, along with "it works for me", "my grandma uses it!", "you just have to buy the right hardware", and "you're using the wrong distro". It is incredibly tiring.

It's a reply to the tiring cognitive dissonance of posts like GP that basically broadcast that 'oh, I would simply love to support open software and general-purpose computing instead of locked-down proprietary platforms, but alas, Linux is simply unusable you see, so I have no choice!'

Yet rather than take at their word that Linux is unsuitable for their use case or seek to remedy those problems, people insist that it must be because of one or more of the reasons I listed above. Alternatively, they attempt to change the user's use case to one that fits Linux better.

It's extremely tiring to watch this happen for as long as I have been watching it happen.

Re: Your Computer Isn't Yours

#469

All this debate in here about software platforms is moot as it all runs on closed-source hardware. I'm a Linux guy, but I certainly don't feel like I "own" my computer, what with my CPU and other hardware components being a black box. This is why debate over cryptographic software is likewise moot, seeing as those algorithms are run on opaque hardware manufactured by major corporations.

By this logic we should just throw up our hands and forget about security and privacy altogether.

Re: Your Computer Isn't Yours

#470

being a devils advocate- isn't this a beta still for the very reason? I'm not sure Apple itself wants to be a developer unfriendly and everyone monitoring company + unencrypted traffic looks like something quick and dirty (analytics about beta users and issues?) Maybe let's get an Apple's response first on these issues? It's not these issues and implications are small, but shouting from very beginning is not a good w…

ps. all OSX developers unite? :D
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