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Docker fails to launch on Apple Silicon

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Re: Docker fails to launch on Apple Silicon

#111

Post by djxfade »

mhh__ wrote: post #94
shiado wrote: post #16

I'm actually tempted to get one of the new Macbook Airs. There's something intriguing and fun about navigating the brokenness of a new ecosystem. Does anybody know how Steam handles the new macs?

If you can burn the cash then go for it, but unless these laptops can support something other than MacOS I'm (with a sad expression) staying away from them. Obviously if you just make websites it doesn't matter but if I'm buying an ARM device I want to play with the bare metal (you can't even access performance counters in MacOS IIRC)

> Obviously if you just make websites it doesn't matter

Websites in 2020 is not that simple. At my workplace, we use Docker extensively in our build pipelines

Re: Docker fails to launch on Apple Silicon

#112

Post by monocasa »

sp332 wrote: post #91
jrockway wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Docker for Mac is a Linux VM with some tools to glue your Mac to that VM. It gives you the illusion that your Mac is running containers, but it's not -- Linux containers are a Linux thing. Some virtualization is going to be necessary unless your host OS is Linux. One could argue that maybe MacOS should somehow run the Linux kernel. Windows tried that as WSLv1 and it didn't work that well; WSLv2 just uses a VM. The ne…

Windows runs containers without a Linux kernel. They made a runC API out of existing Windows APIs. runV and VMWare Vsphere 7 can run each container in its own VM. WSL v1 did not run a Linux kernel at all, but v2 does.

Windows runs _Windows_ containers without a Linux kernel.

And even with WSL1, they didn't implement the cgroups APIs, and couldn't support Linux containers.

Re: Docker fails to launch on Apple Silicon

#113

Post by olliej »

The DTK notes stated explicitly that virtualization was not supported, and equally explicitly that release hardware would support it.

Just the DTK said explicitly that 4k pages were not supported under rosetta but would be by release - that's what broke chrome and apps that are just glorified copies of chrome.

Re: Docker fails to launch on Apple Silicon

#114

Post by ellis0n »

ogre_codes wrote: post #13

This link is a little confusing because the top comment and much of the conversation is talking about the DTK which was based on the much older A12X CPU and not the M1. As far as I can tell, the M1 does have virtualization support, Docker just isn't ported yet. Update: Also, from Apple docs it seems like you won't be able to run emulation and virtualization in the same process. So you can run x86 Mac apps, but it's l…

Looks like Valgrind 32-bit porting story to Mac 64-bit

Re: Docker fails to launch on Apple Silicon

#115

Post by jcelerier »

black3r wrote: post #99
frogblast wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, lots of confusion in this thread. A12Z/DTK: HW does not support virtualization at all. Apple M1 / New Apple Products: HW does support virtualization for ARM64 guests (both windows and linux demonstrated). What about x86 software in the guestOS? Not with Rosetta. Instead, the guest OS will have to provide its own translation (such as windows/arm's current x86->arm64 or upcoming x86_64->arm64 feature). I'm not f…

> Docker w/ arm linux kernel + x86 userland images as mentioned in the issue comments: Docker x86 version already supports running ARM images via qemu out of the box on Windows and Mac, so x86 images via qemu on ARM host should not be a problem...

> Docker x86 version already supports running ARM images via qemu out of the box on Windows and Mac

it "works", but on my overpowered i7, running a raspberry pi docker image that way with qemu-user-static is... only marginally faster than running the code on an actual rpi 3, which is pretty much potato-levels of power.

Re: Docker fails to launch on Apple Silicon

#117

Post by olliej »

otterley wrote: post #27
coldcode wrote: post #5

The first AS Macs are targeted at people who don't need things like docker. Eventually all the support needed will be available. It's a two year transition, you have to start somewhere.

We don't know yet whether M1 will be able to support a hypervisor, so it's just too soon to say. I know it's not the HN culture, but I encourage everyone to take a deep breath and be patient for the actual hardware to arrive.

It absolutely will - this post is referencing a July post which means it's the DTK.

Apple explicitly said that the DTK does not support hypervisors, and that final consumer hardware would. People posting garbage reports like this to HN annoys the hell out of me.

Re: Docker fails to launch on Apple Silicon

#120

Post by ForHackernews »

mhh__ wrote: post #89
freetime2 wrote: post #44

I will not be buying one of these first generation M1 devices because of issues like this. But in the long term I actually think it’s going to be a really good thing for the industry if we can get more developers using non-x86 devices and deploying code to non-x86 servers.

Having people working on fast ARM machines will be good, although I do worry that apple will be apple and you'll never be able to run (say) Linux on said ARM chips. I used to be fairly laissez-faire about it but now I really think it should be legally required for at least some level of freedom for the end users to be supported (technologically rather than as in customer service) by big tech companies selling hardwar…

Wait, you can't install a non MacOS on these things? Are they basically an iPad in a notebook form factor?
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