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Google knows where we are, and so do advertisers

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Re: Google knows where we are, and so do advertisers

#141

Post by kortilla »

feralimal wrote: post #96
randomsearch wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They were planned to make your private information into a commodity. Are you seriously suggesting then when Apple launched the iPhone it was a plan to spy on you?

Did you ever wonder about the discrepancy in tech that occurred at that time the first iPhone appeared? We were all using desktops or fairly clunky laptops. Then, out of nowhere, we have touchscreens, cameras, maps, etc AND the power of a desktop machine, in a device that's 1/20th the size! It was such a staggering leap! I think phones were technology that was so far ahead of what we were prepared for, we had no mean…

> Did you ever wonder about the discrepancy in tech that occurred at that time the first iPhone appeared? We were all using desktops or fairly clunky laptops. Then, out of nowhere, we have touchscreens, cameras, maps, etc AND the power of a desktop machine, in a device that's 1/20th the size! It was such a staggering leap!

I was around when it came out. There was no staggering leap. The first iPhone was nowhere near desktop power and the camera wasn’t meaningfully better than what was available in other high-end “feature phones” or the blackberry.

The major breakthrough was the real browser and the capacitive touchscreen. It didn’t even have an App Store.

Re: Google knows where we are, and so do advertisers

#142

Post by [deleted] »

texasbigdata wrote: post #130
absolutelyrad wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> https://transparencyreport.google.com/user-data/overview WTF? This makes me extremely uncomfortable for some reason. There was some hope in mind that Snowden was exaggerating but this is just insane. It feels like liberty has failed. There's no other option but to give in and accept. I submit to the overlords, but I'm not happy about this.

This is bad math but there’s 220 million “elligible” Americans (not too young, not too old); if we assume 85% cellphone/ tech penetration that represents 0.1% of all Americans a year on napkin bar math.

[deleted]

Re: Google knows where we are, and so do advertisers

#143

Post by tsjq »

BiteCode_dev wrote: post #70

The place where I currently work assigned me a gmail address, and I wanted to check them on my phone. I was using k9 for my personal stuff, and wanted another app for the pro mails, so I pulled out the gmail app. Just one step before finalizing the setup process, I realized that google was asking me to accept Google Play terms of service. WTF? It turns out the gmail app setup process does much more, google takes over…

Woah ! That's scary

Re: Google knows where we are, and so do advertisers

#144

Post by proactivesvcs »

maxmunzel wrote: post #104
raxxorrax wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always deactivate geolocation and I assume and hope it doesn't phone home to Google in that case. I still deactivate network if I don't need it. Android devices cannot really be trusted and it seems to be getting worse. Of course I am not using contact tracing either in this case, but I certainly won't allow Google to trace my location.

If I understand it correctly, contact tracing should rely on bluetooth only. Does it require location services and/or network on Android?

I believe that with the latest version of Android, and on supporting handsets, only Bluetooth is needed. Fraid I can't recall where I read it.

Re: Google knows where we are, and so do advertisers

#145

Post by Mediterraneo10 »

xwolfi wrote: post #131
Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #18

One of the most disappointing changes in Android recently is that any network-assisted geolocation plugins must now be installed as a system app, not a user app. That means that even if you use LineageOS where most Google stuff has been stripped out, getting a GPS fix through network assistance still sends data to Google servers. Only a tiny minority of users are comfortable working with the command line and will ins…

I have a Huawei without Google, and I can do geolocation, maybe you could try that too ? If you use google for search and huawei for map, they can't cross reference to each other since they're forbidden to talk to each others. I actually feel so much better without all the google stuff, weird no?

> I have a Huawei without Google, and I can do geolocation, maybe you could try that too ?

I assume that even if Huawei’s Android sold in the West doesn't use Google Play Services, it still uses standard AOSP, and the issue is that Google geolocation (and some other use of Google servers) is hardcoded into AOSP.

Re: Google knows where we are, and so do advertisers

#147

Post by Phemist »

raxxorrax wrote: post #120
maxmunzel wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I understand it correctly, contact tracing should rely on bluetooth only. Does it require location services and/or network on Android?

Sadly yes. It is probably a software component problem that bluetooth is bundled with location services, but without the separation from GPS, I have serious concerns about privacy, even if I think that I only use well behaved apps.

Bluetooth and location services being bundled is a policy decision by Google. If one has a database filled with historical correlations between bluetooth devices "in range" and GPS coordinates, it is possible to get a pretty accurate fix on someone's location from the current devices that are in range. This is the reason why Google has bundled Bluetooth and GPS in one permission.

Of course, the very fact that these permissions are bundled is the reason why it's feasible to keep such databases up-to-date, and why up-to-date databases provide a continuously stronger case why Bluetooth should be considered a type of location permission..

It would be totally possible to separate location permissions between "passive" location (e.g. triangulation through received GPS coordinates), and "active" location, e.g. inference of location through indirect measures and correlations with historical databases.

Afaik it's now a system-wide setting to disallow said correlations, but offering app developers more fine-grained control would be better for all of us. Why does, for example, my Sony Bluetooth headset need my location just for updating some firmware..

Re: Google knows where we are, and so do advertisers

#148

Post by snarf21 »

tabs_masterrace wrote: post #57

The number of government requests for user information is actually scary: https://transparencyreport.google.com/user-data/overview So Google handed over info on 175k accounts in the last half of 2019 alone? It seems it's becoming common practice to routinely pull citizens data, without much of a warrant and without the target's knowledge. There used to be a thing called secrecy of correspondence, preventing governmen…

I agree this is troubling but no one seems to care that the carriers know where you are 24/7 even when you aren't using your phone.

Re: Google knows where we are, and so do advertisers

#149

Post by fsflover »

absolutelyrad wrote: post #109
tabs_masterrace wrote: post #57

The number of government requests for user information is actually scary: https://transparencyreport.google.com/user-data/overview So Google handed over info on 175k accounts in the last half of 2019 alone? It seems it's becoming common practice to routinely pull citizens data, without much of a warrant and without the target's knowledge. There used to be a thing called secrecy of correspondence, preventing governmen…

> https://transparencyreport.google.com/user-data/overview WTF? This makes me extremely uncomfortable for some reason. There was some hope in mind that Snowden was exaggerating but this is just insane. It feels like liberty has failed. There's no other option but to give in and accept. I submit to the overlords, but I'm not happy about this.

> There's no other option but to give in and accept.

Yes, there are options: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Librem_5 and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PinePhone

Re: Google knows where we are, and so do advertisers

#150

Post by 43920 »

harry-wood wrote: post #121

I can recommend OpenStreetMap alternatives mentioned at the end of the article. I'm not sure why it says they "still collect data". Pretty sure OsmAnd and Maps.ME are not collecting data in any surprising/evil ways (particularly as they can work entirely offline!) The article says they "just aren’t as good" which obviously isn't very specific, but if you live in an area where the map detail doesn't seem so good, then…

Maps.me at least still is collecting data; if you look at their privacy policy (https://legal.my.com/us/maps/privacy/), they use your location data to “tailor and improve the adverts that are presented in the Services“.

As far as I know, OsmAnd is fine, and there’s also a couple of alternatives: https://gurumaps.app/ https://www.qwant.com/maps (Which can be installed as a PWA)

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