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Apple Silicon M1 chip in MacBook Air outperforms high-end 16-inch MacBook Pro
701–710 of 1001 posts
Re: Apple Silicon M1 chip in MacBook Air outperforms high-end 16-inch MacBook Pro
#702Earlier quoted context omitted.
The results seem a little weird but if remotely true then these machines are going to sell like cup cakes. Why would anyone (who is not forced) buy an Intel PC laptop when these are available and priced as competitive as they are?
The Macbook Air with 16GB RAM and 512GB isn't really priced competitively here in Germany. It's almost 1600€.
It's not trying to compete with German PCs (which have some nice options, but yet are Windows PCs, not Macs).
I'm not an Apple fanboy, and I'm still very displeased with many of their decisions (touchbar being #1 on MBPs). But if you consider the packaging (small, light, sturdy, now-decent keyboard), and consider their performance, and then consider macOS, I think they are more than competitive.
Even if you match every spec, including size/weight and durability, it comes down to Windows vs macOS. Ironically, macOS is free while Windows is not, but macOS is worth more (to me and many others).
Re: Apple Silicon M1 chip in MacBook Air outperforms high-end 16-inch MacBook Pro
#703Earlier quoted context omitted.
The results seem a little weird but if remotely true then these machines are going to sell like cup cakes. Why would anyone (who is not forced) buy an Intel PC laptop when these are available and priced as competitive as they are?
> Why would anyone (who is not forced) buy an Intel PC laptop when these are available and priced as competitive as they are? - locked bootloader - no bootcamp - can't install or boot linux or windows - virtualization limited to arm64 machines - no windows x86 or linux x86 virtual machines - only 2 thunderbolt ports - limited to 16GB RAM - no external gpu support/drivers - can't use nvidia or amd cards - no AAA gamin…
> "no AAA gaming"
This is, arguably, a disadvantage of any Mac.
But Apple Silicon may actually improve the situation over time, as having the same GPUs and APIs on Macs and iOS devices means there is now a much bigger market for game developers to target with the same codebase.
Re: Apple Silicon M1 chip in MacBook Air outperforms high-end 16-inch MacBook Pro
#704Earlier quoted context omitted.
€1665 in Czechia, and we have much lower purchasing power.
To be honest, you'd expect widely traded good to trade at the same prices, regardless of local purchasing power.
I think it often depends on big resellers (like Best Buy, for example). They can provide discounts which Apple will not do directly to the customer, and which other resellers can't do because they don't turn enough units.
That's true of many other common goods worldwide. Unless you can buy a locally made item in a lower purchasing power country, you will usually pay a currency exchange equivalent price for the item. Actually you often pay more because the local shop selling the product cannot get bulk pricing and pass along the discount to you.
Finally, when you add the local taxes - 23% in Portugal, for example - the price can be much higher compared to Alaska, US (< 2%). That last bit is really not Apple's fault.
Re: Apple Silicon M1 chip in MacBook Air outperforms high-end 16-inch MacBook Pro
#705Kind of remarkable for a laptop without a fan. (Infamous fan-hater Steve Jobs would be proud.) Power/thermal management looks very good - low heat and long battery life without sacrificing performance. Presumably the Air will have to throttle performance for some workloads, but not in this benchmark apparently.
Was Steve Jobs an infamous fan-hater? What did he do/say?
Yeah, he wasn't a fan.
Re: Apple Silicon M1 chip in MacBook Air outperforms high-end 16-inch MacBook Pro
#706There were talks of splitting Google and other huge companies due to their size ( https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2020/10/house-amazon-fac... ). Wouldn't it be awesome if Apple's CPU/IC design segment became a separate company and sold these CPUs and maybe SoC by themselves? I think that would make a big dent into AMD/Intel market shares. Since Apple's part/die should be quite a bit smaller than most of the x86 d…
No, it wouldn't be awesome.
This thing ONLY EXISTS in the first place because of Apple's continual vertical integration push, and because other parts of the business were able to massively subsidise the R&D costs necessary to come up with a competitive SOC in an established market that's otherwise a duopoly. If their CPU/IC design segment were its own company, the M1 would never have seen the light of day. Period.
Furthermore, this chip is not meant to be a retail product. It's optimised for the exact requirements that Apple's products have. The whole reason why they're able to beat Intel/AMD is because they don't have to cater to the exact same generic market that the established players do, but instead massively optimise for their exact needs.
I genuinely don't understand how can anyone who wishes to break up Apple not see that these things?
Re: Apple Silicon M1 chip in MacBook Air outperforms high-end 16-inch MacBook Pro
#707Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's also funny that Johny Srouji and probably others in his team come from the team at Intel in Israel that "saved" Intel in the early 2000s by designing the Intel Core architecture which is still used by Intel today. cf. Anandtech article from 2003: https://www.anandtech.com/show/1083/2
Some people are priceless. One of the designers of Ryzen, Jim Keller [1], for example. [1] https://www.anandtech.com/show/12689/cpu-design-guru-jim-kel...
And now he’s left Intel
https://www.anandtech.com/show/15846/jim-keller-resigns-from...
Re: Apple Silicon M1 chip in MacBook Air outperforms high-end 16-inch MacBook Pro
#708Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Why would anyone (who is not forced) buy an Intel PC laptop when these are available and priced as competitive as they are? - locked bootloader - no bootcamp - can't install or boot linux or windows - virtualization limited to arm64 machines - no windows x86 or linux x86 virtual machines - only 2 thunderbolt ports - limited to 16GB RAM - no external gpu support/drivers - can't use nvidia or amd cards - no AAA gamin…
> "no AAA gaming" This is, arguably, a disadvantage of any Mac. But Apple Silicon may actually improve the situation over time, as having the same GPUs and APIs on Macs and iOS devices means there is now a much bigger market for game developers to target with the same codebase.
It's more about losing the ability to boot into windows to game there, as well as losing egpu support.
Re: Apple Silicon M1 chip in MacBook Air outperforms high-end 16-inch MacBook Pro
#709> The M1 chip, which belongs to a MacBook Air with 8GB RAM, features a single-core score of 1687 and a multi-core score of 7433. According to the benchmark, the M1 has a 3.2GHz base frequency. > The Mac mini with M1 chip that was benchmarked earned a single-core score of 1682 and a multi-core score of 7067. > Update: There's also a benchmark for the 13-inch MacBook Pro with M1 chip and 16GB RAM that has a single-core…
A14 Air outperforms all iPad Pros in single core, multicore is still faster on the A12X. Keep in mind the fastest iPad Pro is using a two generation old cpu.
I have watched a number of reviews comparing the new Air to the Pro. The CPU performance increase isn't noticeable in most cases, and the Pro still offers better pencil latency and display refresh rate (plus camera/lidar, but probably most don't care).
I wouldn't buy a Pro now because I would wait for the next version, but I wouldn't trade a current Pro for a new Air just for the CPU bump...
Re: Apple Silicon M1 chip in MacBook Air outperforms high-end 16-inch MacBook Pro
#710There were talks of splitting Google and other huge companies due to their size ( https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2020/10/house-amazon-fac... ). Wouldn't it be awesome if Apple's CPU/IC design segment became a separate company and sold these CPUs and maybe SoC by themselves? I think that would make a big dent into AMD/Intel market shares. Since Apple's part/die should be quite a bit smaller than most of the x86 d…
No, it wouldn't be awesome. This thing ONLY EXISTS in the first place because of Apple's continual vertical integration push, and because other parts of the business were able to massively subsidise the R&D costs necessary to come up with a competitive SOC in an established market that's otherwise a duopoly. If their CPU/IC design segment were its own company, the M1 would never have seen the light of day. Period. Fu…
> This thing ONLY EXISTS in the first place because of Apple's continual vertical integration push
This seems pretty grounded.
> The whole reason why they're able to beat Intel/AMD is because they don't have to cater to the exact same generic market that the established players do, but instead massively optimise for their exact needs.
I'm less convinced of this. Their exact needs seem to be making laptops... and so these chips would make interesting candidates for other laptops, if split off from Apple.
It's never going to happen, and an independent company might struggle for R&D money, but if these prove to be better laptop CPUs there is a market there.