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.NET 5.0

devblogs.microsoft.com

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Re: .NET 5.0

#121

Post by BoorishBears »

virgilp wrote: post #82
mmis1000 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is literally how php does. Let's fire a thread for every request and block on db reading or any action that require io. And it seems it works (at least for php)

.NET is meant for stuff like microservices; you don't see lots of those written in php, right? Also, for high-traffic websites, that's really not a great idea. You might say "but Facebook, PHP" - I'm really certain that their current codebase doesn't have a thread that blocks on DB for each user request.

I don't get why the auth being async is a hang up but at the same time, most projects can handle not scaling to Facebook-scale and the sooner developers accept that, the sooner we can escape a great gnashing of teeth.

I'd be willing to bet more projects have been killed by trying to architecture for performance up front than have been killed by being too successful for their own good and keeling over.

If Twitter could make it past the Fail Whale days, I think most of us can too.

Re: .NET 5.0

#122

Post by mattmanser »

sbelskie wrote: post #72
mattmanser wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know a better way of doing this? appsettings.Test.json Voila, different settings! I've said elsewhere, the DEFAULT should be super simple, really, really, really easy to use. No thought, no effort, just use it. If you want to go all crazy and start injecting values into your config in your unit tests, great to have that option, you should have that option. But you're the one who should be scrabbling around writin…

I’m confused as to what you want instead of what Asp.Net core offers. Nothing is forcing you to inject configuration or to use IOptions. In most cases you don’t even need to do anything with the configuration builder because that is part of the default of how the host gets setup. You’re configuration should be automatically built from environment vars and appsettings.json. And of course you can always just access env…

I think they should have done what every other framework does and make it super easy to access, like this:

    Env.Config("Settings:MyEasyValue");
Or:

    Env.Config().MySuperEasyTypedValue;
And the Dependency Injection? Sure, add some version you can DI with. But not the default.

I now know how to navigate the mess they've made, but it's not time that I feel where I gained anything in my life, it was just frustrating.

Here's one (of many) questions asking simple questions on how to access config values in .Net core:

https://stackoverflow.com/questions/46940710/getting-value-f...

280k views!

And look at the sheer length of that answer.

If you think they succeeded in making a good configuration library, we have very different definitions of success.

Re: .NET 5.0

#123

Post by mwcampbell »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #58
mmd45 wrote: post #10

the highlights are great. 2 lowlights: - HttpClient/WebRequest ReadWriteTimeout is silently ignored which can result in infinitely hung sockets when doing synchronous network i/o - System.Speech is unsupported

Refusing to support System.Speech is why my project will remain locked to .NET Framework. Apparently the Microsoft Speech team is part of Azure now, and has decided nobody needs local speech synthesis that doesn't require a subscription to a cloud service.

IIUC, System.Speech was simply a .NET wrapper for the Microsoft Speech API (SAPI), which has been part of Windows for a long time. If you want to move to .NET Core, you can use SAPI via COM interop.

Disclosure: I currently work at Microsoft on the Windows accessibility team. We don't own SAPI or System.Speech, but we consume SAPI in Narrator (via COM in C++).

Re: .NET 5.0

#124

Post by Scarbutt »

tester756 wrote: post #113
js4ever wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have migrated from C# to Node.js, my code is now 20x times shorter (from 800 files to 40 files), simpler to read and maintain, there is 100x more packages available on NPM compared to nuget. Performance is stellar, even better than in C# for my use case (Mega tons of concurrent queries executed in 1-5ms avg) And also I don't have to fight against the language to do what I want to do ... No classes, no types, no con…

>20x times shorter that's giant, but I don't think that "just" language / environment difference makes this huge difference

I would say 2x-5x shorter is pretty realistic.

Re: .NET 5.0

#125

Post by mmd45 »

mwcampbell wrote: post #123
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Refusing to support System.Speech is why my project will remain locked to .NET Framework. Apparently the Microsoft Speech team is part of Azure now, and has decided nobody needs local speech synthesis that doesn't require a subscription to a cloud service.

IIUC, System.Speech was simply a .NET wrapper for the Microsoft Speech API (SAPI), which has been part of Windows for a long time. If you want to move to .NET Core, you can use SAPI via COM interop. Disclosure: I currently work at Microsoft on the Windows accessibility team. We don't own SAPI or System.Speech, but we consume SAPI in Narrator (via COM in C++).

why doesn't MS just release the SAPI wrapper as a windows only nuget package since it already exists?

Re: .NET 5.0

#126

Post by nightski »

mattmanser wrote: post #122
sbelskie wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m confused as to what you want instead of what Asp.Net core offers. Nothing is forcing you to inject configuration or to use IOptions. In most cases you don’t even need to do anything with the configuration builder because that is part of the default of how the host gets setup. You’re configuration should be automatically built from environment vars and appsettings.json. And of course you can always just access env…

I think they should have done what every other framework does and make it super easy to access, like this: Env.Config("Settings:MyEasyValue"); Or: Env.Config ().MySuperEasyTypedValue; And the Dependency Injection? Sure, add some version you can DI with. But not the default. I now know how to navigate the mess they've made, but it's not time that I feel where I gained anything in my life, it was just frustrating. Here…

It would be pretty trivial to implement the Env class you desire abstracting away the DI stuff.

Re: .NET 5.0

#127

Post by GordonS »

mattmanser wrote: post #23

So, on the plus side with the new .net, I recently made a .net core web app on Linux, and generally it's been pretty easy. I'm also impressed at just how fast asp.net core is compared to asp.net, the time it takes to open your site in debug mode has dropped dramatically, from what used to be 1/2 minute in asp.net to a few seconds in .net core. On the bad side? Mainly the asp.net core team and their push for Dependenc…

> My biggest bugbear is the way you access your config, which is an absolute and utter kafka-esque mess. Because someone at MS was drinking the DI kool-aid you have to add a minimum of 5 lines of code to any class you want to access config values in

I'm not sure if maybe you're referring to the Options stuff?

The way I do it is pretty simple.

1. Create a POCO that represents your config. You can have properties for bested configs if you want, e.g. SecurityConfig, MessageBusConfig 2. When the app starts, use a ConfigurationBuilder to build an IConfiguration from whatever Co fig sources you want - typically JSON files and env vars 3. Bind the IConfiguration to your POCO 4. Configure both IConfiguration and the POCO as singletons

Now you can inject the POCO config object wherever you want it, or the IConfiguration should you need it. I feel like this is simple, and works well for dev, test and prod.

Re: .NET 5.0

#128

Post by ArtifTh »

js4ever wrote: post #100
Lendal wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I found Go to be a really nice replacement for C#. It has the static typing and garbage collection, but you also get a self-contained binary executing without the requirement of an external runtime environment. I also discovered that I don't miss classes at all.

I have migrated from C# to Node.js, my code is now 20x times shorter (from 800 files to 40 files), simpler to read and maintain, there is 100x more packages available on NPM compared to nuget. Performance is stellar, even better than in C# for my use case (Mega tons of concurrent queries executed in 1-5ms avg) And also I don't have to fight against the language to do what I want to do ... No classes, no types, no con…

Huh, that's quite a dramatic code size reduction. Which percentage of this codebase was in tests and boilerplate code for stuff like helper data classes?

Re: .NET 5.0

#129

Post by merb »

mattmanser wrote: post #76
tester756 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do agree I just type IOptions config in ctor, use ctrl+. and private readonly property and it's initialization is generated

That doesn't work unless you already have the using statements, which you won't have as you haven't added it yet. I just tried it.

you can use property injection when you use something like autofac as the di container.

Re: .NET 5.0

#130

Post by GordonS »

mattmanser wrote: post #23

So, on the plus side with the new .net, I recently made a .net core web app on Linux, and generally it's been pretty easy. I'm also impressed at just how fast asp.net core is compared to asp.net, the time it takes to open your site in debug mode has dropped dramatically, from what used to be 1/2 minute in asp.net to a few seconds in .net core. On the bad side? Mainly the asp.net core team and their push for Dependenc…

> and you're in for an even bigger nightmare if you want to separate business logic and web code into two projects (which is a pretty common design)

I do this with a lot (most?) web apps, and don't have any issues with it at all - what kind of problems are you seeing?

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